r/DestinyTheGame • u/Beastintheomlet • Jun 08 '18
Bungie Suggestion Full Faction Rally armor should net you more tokens when winning in PvP.
I'm enjoying the Faction Rally over all, and I understand why PvE is heavily favored for gaining Faction rep. I do think though that if you wear a full set of your faction's gear you should get 8-10 tokens when winning a match compared to 5.
I think there are 3 reasons this is a fair change.
Not using any exotic armor is imposing a slight disadvantage on yourself. Like how Renown allows you to increase your difficult for more reward this would be similar.
The whole narrative of the Faction Rally is that you being the Guardian who slays gods flying your Faction's colors is meaningful.
Matches take around 10 minutes if you include matchmaking time. I do think PvE should be more optimal than PvP, and it still would be faster to do a patrol and PE than a full match.
As someone who likes to spend time in the Crucible in addition to PvE it'd be nice to rep my faction while dunking on the Graviton Lance sweats with Fighting Lion.
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u/Krytan Jun 08 '18
The extra tokens on victory when wearing full faction set armor is great. You should also get bonus tokens if you kill an enemy guardian wearing their full faction set.
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u/EVula Jun 08 '18
It would only make sense with the lore if you get that bonus only when it’s a different faction. (So zero tokens if you take out someone of the same faction)
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u/SMFar20 Jun 09 '18
Oh my god. A special playlist for faction rallies where the first kill against an opposing faction member nets you two tokens. So you could potentially max out at 8 per match.
We'd finally get everyone to choose different factions.
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u/APartyInMyPants Jun 08 '18
I’d rather net more tokens than renown.
Case in point. Last light was running with a friend who did not have the full faction set yet (we both switched to DO for the Graviton catalyst). So I did my public event and my patrol and I was maxed out. He, however, only had four.
So I ended up doing one more patrol with him anyway to get the max renown for him.
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u/CrotasMinion Crota lives Jun 08 '18
I agree 100%. Wearing full faction armor ANYWHERE should get more tokens from the events.
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u/eightb1t Jun 08 '18
I always felt like Faction Rallies were to PVE what Iron Banner was to PVP.
I didn't get IB tokens in PVE, I don't think I should get Faction Tokens in Crucible.
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u/xnasty Jun 08 '18
Iron Banner has cosmetics, Faction Rallies now have actual game changing items and I honestly dislike having to shelf crucible for so long to grind so being able to earn a few doing what I normally do is nice.
Also, making it a PvE only thing is contradictory to the whole concept, which is to rep your faction, including in Crucible.
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u/eightb1t Jun 08 '18
Yea, I think I was wrong here. Someone in the thread said it'd be cool if we got 1 token for killing an opposing team during the match. How fucking cool would that be? Faction Wars in PVP and Faction Rally in PVE.
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u/xnasty Jun 09 '18
I’m hoping we can press Bungie a bit and get a unique riff on the Renown and token concept for Crucible, I don’t want a flat reward but I want it to become something that actually can change how Crucible feels for a week (or can be ignored if you don’t care)
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u/Lefarsi Jun 09 '18
Iron banner sells a plethora of specific guns. So does dead orbit. I don't like having to pause raiding to grind pvp, but I see what I like, branch out, and get rewarded for doing so. (I actually kinda like 6v6, but still, crucible ain't my thing)
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u/xnasty Jun 09 '18
Literally nothing from iron banner is worth pausing content you enjoy doing unless you really want to collect guns: there is one gun from trials and one from IB i could even remotely recommend as viable options. Exotic catalysts on the other hand, those are a different story.
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u/mrP0P0 Jun 08 '18
This is why Rallies are limited. The next time they come around they can tweak the mechanics.
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u/Beastintheomlet Jun 08 '18
Absolutely. I’ve never requested anything before but thought I’d put this out there as suggestion for next go around.
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u/o8Stu Jun 08 '18
I think the requirement to be wearing full faction gear sets for some of the ornaments is BS considering that they aren't selling armor or automatically dropping it at rank intervals. I've got all but 1 piece on 2 of my characters thanks to the pure RNG goodness after 30+ ranks.
That said, the rewards for a PvP match should roughly stack up with an equivalent time investment in PvE. In spite of how it looks, the factions, as they relate to Guardians, are more about crucible than any other activities.
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u/HarleyQuinn_RS Angels can't help you here. Jun 08 '18
It's also BS considering Ornaments are unlocked per character, not account-wide.
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u/spinto1 Jun 08 '18
2 pieces have the same challenge and 2 of the remaining 3 are easy (loot a lost sector on class items or nade, melee, or crit kill this faction) but the chest for each class is a pain in the ass. They could have the same two count cross class at least.
Titan: 25 Heroic PE's
Hunter: get a ton of ability multikills (don't know the numbers here, but tether doesn't count so its a bit nasty)
Warlock: kill 20 High Value Targets
These 3 are a slog, but we have 2 weeks (unconfirmed, but likely) to do them.
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u/iAmWrythm Shohreh Aghdashloo is bae. Jun 08 '18
Yuck, is that Dead Orbit or something? FWC isn't nearly as bad.
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u/o8Stu Jun 08 '18
The DO hunter chestpiece equates to 25 super multikills if my math is correct. I've done 4 and am at 16%.
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u/ShoreXShot 5 Thousand hours in... Jun 08 '18
it is 85 multikills :( for chest and 65 charged melee for the arms
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u/o8Stu Jun 08 '18
Must go off the number of kills then, not the number of times you cast your super and got more than one kill with it.
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u/Gekoz Jun 08 '18
Having dropped them early in 15 ranks, having the full set is SUCH an improvement because High value targets / patrols net you 2 renown instead of 1. Combine it with an exotic ghost that gives +1 rep token on X planet, and you can get an 16 token extremely fast with a PE + Patrol into 5 Renown Lost Sector.
Next time I hope Bungie just sells the set right away.
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u/lokoskanker Drifter's Crew // Alright, alright, alright... Jun 08 '18
They are trying trying to gain power. Getting supplies and going after enemies makes a lot more sense.
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u/o8Stu Jun 08 '18
"Power" isn't just supplies though. They act as sponsors for Guardians in the crucible as a means of garnering popular support among the City's residents. You'll hear people in the tower talking about watching crucible matches like it was a football game, and the factions sponsor all of that.
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u/K_U Jun 09 '18
Got my Warlock set by rank 14, took until rank 49 to finish the Hunter set. Don't have a single piece for my Titan.
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u/waxmycrax Jun 08 '18
You should get 1 token for every kill (final blow) with faction weapons on guardians of the other factions.
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u/Beastintheomlet Jun 08 '18
Oooh, that'd be very interesting. I like that.
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u/eightb1t Jun 08 '18
Crap...I like this idea way better than my, "keep pve and pvp different".
This is a brilliant idea.
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u/xnasty Jun 08 '18
As nobody earns anything because everyone in crucible is obviously dead orbit
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u/KawaiiBakemono Jun 08 '18 edited Jun 08 '18
This. Just make it "per kill", ignore faction affiliation. Not quite perfect if you are trying for lore but still works considering every guardian is competing to be legendary for their faction, even against their fellow Dead Orbit allies.
....not that Bungie would even do something remotely interesting like this, mind you, so it's kind of pointless to even be discussing it.
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u/IlikeDestiny2 Fighting Lion Is Good Tho :( Jun 08 '18
30 tokens a game? balanced.
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u/KawaiiBakemono Jun 08 '18
If you can get 30 killing blows in a 4v4 Crucible match, you deserve 30 tokens, imo.
That's more than I (and probably most everyone) have ever gotten in a single match.
Are there any statistics on the average number of kills per match? Maybe you're right....I honestly don't know.
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u/xnasty Jun 09 '18
You’d be surprised how few actual kills people accumulate, you can look on places like destinytracker
KDA says 3.0 and you had 35 eliminations but the actual killing blow might be around 10 or 12 unless you’re a crack shot/shotgun main
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u/xnasty Jun 09 '18
Actually I think they’re more open than ever to getting interesting, renown is a solid concept they should riff on more. We should be pressing them to adapt it to Crucible to offer a different (but unique) path to the faction grind.
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Jun 08 '18
I wish the armor pieces would drop more as well. I cleaned out all my faction armor ages ago to free up vault space. Never imagined I'd ever have a use for it until now.
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u/blackbenetavo Jun 08 '18
I have been having a grand time playing Mayhem all night. It's okay not getting as many tokens. But, yes, you definitely should get some bonus for full faction armor.
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u/Rogueshadow_32 Ape together strong Jun 08 '18
You see the thing is you need a full set for that and I’m at rank 30 and those arms are nowhere to be seen
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u/iAmWrythm Shohreh Aghdashloo is bae. Jun 08 '18
Oh word? Rank 60 and no Hunter legs.
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u/Rogueshadow_32 Ape together strong Jun 08 '18
Riperino my dude
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u/iAmWrythm Shohreh Aghdashloo is bae. Jun 08 '18
LOL, I ended up getting them in 4 straight packages after that. TROLLERINO.
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u/Beastintheomlet Jun 08 '18
I think it’s silly you can’t buy the armor pieces. Especially after halfway through the ranks.
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u/BigBadBen_10 Jun 08 '18
Should get more tokens from Strikes than anything else, due to the amount of time they take.
Crucible should give 5 for a loss, maybe 10 for a win. The 2 for a loss is rubbish for the time commitment compared to doing a public event.
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Jun 08 '18 edited Jun 08 '18
Faction tokens in PVP need a buff just in general. They need to incorporate some kind of challenge system in PVP like they have done this season.
the renown system could work as a “killstreak” like getting more renown as you get killstreaks or maybe have a certain amount of kills threshold that would raise your renown, and could reset each match like lost sectors do.
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u/EmpireoftheExiled Jun 08 '18
Agreed... PvP is by far my fave in the game, its roughly 12 minute a game? Least they can do is figure per a minute for renown and give us maybe 20 tokens every 2 or 3 match?
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u/Ciscokid45 Vanguard's Loyal Jun 08 '18
yeah there is no insentive to do pvp during faction rally
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u/spinto1 Jun 08 '18
Detrimental even considering how much pve grinding there is to do in such a short time.
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u/xnasty Jun 08 '18
I finished the 50 grind yesterday so it’s nice to be able to earn more tokens while going back to the crucible
But yea they need a creative way to incentivize crucible during faction rally. I don’t want the income normalized across the board cause that’s boring but make it something that feels special for the faction rally.
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u/NEONHAZ13 Jun 08 '18
Upvoted purely for fighting lion
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u/The_Owl_Bard A New Chapter, for An Old Legend Jun 08 '18
Yeah I noticed that yesterday too. I got a little burned out getting on that Titan PE/ Lost Sector Grind. Played Mayhem and was a little surprised that there wasn't any sort of reward for wearing faction armor.
I think offering more rewards to someone who wants to do both PvP and PvE. Maybe a collectable bounty system like D1, a layer on top of Shaxx crucible bounties so you can earn an extra couple of tokens, or a specific PVP mode that will allow us to get more tokens for competing with faction armors on. Maybe a straight up 6v6 clash mode with randomly spawning objectives?
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u/Wolfblur Beeg Titan Jun 08 '18
I just hope they add a 3v3v3 or something in Crucible Labs for Faction battles or something
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u/Awsomonium Chaperone Catalyst with Icarus Grip please? Jun 08 '18
I reckon full faction set should grant a 50% increase to token in all activities. The more renown thing is awesome, but if we're keeping rank 50, we're gonna needore ways to get them quicker. Because some of us have the time for that but a lot of us don't.
I mean I do have the time personally. But the argument for "you put in the time, you get the rewards" only works if you actually have the time.
That's not about wanting easier rewards. It's just about taking into account busy work schedules and people with children and not being able to grind for more than 30 minutes because of things like this.
You can probably tell I know people in this boat.
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u/epitat Jun 08 '18
I agree wearing a full faction set should reward more tokens in crucible, I remember in D1, you gained 30% rep with full set , faction shader and faction emblem
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u/TheIronLorde Jun 08 '18
The whole narrative of the Faction Rally is that you being the Guardian who slays gods flying your Faction's colors is meaningful.
Well by that logic you should have tokens taken away for a loss in full faction armor because you're making them look bad.
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u/Beastintheomlet Jun 08 '18
I figure if you go on a 5 game losing streak over the course of an hour and only have 10 tokens to show for it that’s more than punishing enough.
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u/TheIronLorde Jun 08 '18
Right but everyone gets that. If you want the added reward, there has to be added risk, just like with renown in PvE. You want more tokens for making them look good when you win, you have to risk not getting any when you lose and make them look bad.
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u/Blue2501 Jun 08 '18
there has to be added risk, just like with renown in PvE.
I feel like, the way it works now, it's not 'risk vs. reward', but 'risk vs. don't bother 'cause you're wasting your time'
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u/Bumpanalog Jun 08 '18
Why?
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u/TheIronLorde Jun 08 '18
The rally is all about the factions posturing for glory and power, and you go out there decked out like a billboard and lose? It gives them a bad rep, why would they reward that?
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u/mariachiskeleton Jun 08 '18
Losing teams still harbor large fanbases, hell you don't have to look any further than FWC as an example. Win or lose, you are getting the brand name out there.
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u/The_Almighty_GFK Cries in Grenades Jun 08 '18
Would be a cool idea if they had a separate crucible mode called "Faction Wars" where you had to use the full faction armor, and had to use faction weapons.
Not sure how the game mode would go, maybe get matched up with other people who pledged to the same faction as you, and do a 3v3v3 type of crucible against teams of the other factions?
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u/xnasty Jun 08 '18
I’ve been wanting something like this for a while but the logistics of it seem impossible. Matchmaking based on faction, when there’s a massive population disparity as is doesn’t seem like it will work.
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u/Sphincter_Revelation Jun 08 '18
Pvp kills while in full faction armor should net your more progress towards the ornaments too.
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u/RPO1728 Jun 08 '18
First, it should allow an exotic... Secondly, it should reward a few extra coins with anything you do
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Jun 08 '18
[removed] — view removed comment
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u/Beastintheomlet Jun 08 '18
It does. Just to clarify, full armor set doesn't make a difference in PvP, this is a suggestion. In PvE the full set gives you +1 Renown each time you get any.
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u/Dots4Days I'm not one of them D.O. Cata trolls. Jun 08 '18
I think it would be cool to have a 'Faction Rally Deathmatch." This would be a 2 v 2 v 2 or 3 v 3 v 3 (whatever they can get. 2 or 3 of each factions. Winner gets the payout of Tokens.
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Jun 08 '18
This has been discussed ad nauseum in one form or another - They really just need set bonuses.
I wish they would remove the raid armor special perks for regular mods, but then give you the raid bonuses as you wear more pieces. The total bonus should be at least exotic level.
Full raid armor - maybe you get immune from pulls and pushes - no Psion purple shit, no Tractor Cannon pushes, no Xol launches, take stomp damage but don't get pushed back.
Full planetary armor - some sort of bonus against a particular enemy.
Full faction armor - bonus tokens
Full Trials armor - maybe a little extra radar distance or resolution
Full IB armor - slight resistance to team shooting (whoever tags your first does normal damage, but second hitter does a little bit less)
Or stuff like that...
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u/ThatArcticFox Jun 08 '18
They should add more tokens to strikes. I'm earning 3 to 4 times more tokens doing public events. A strike only gets me about 5 tokens. Takes longer to run for less reward? Not worth it. And we should definitely receive more tokens for running full faction armor sets.
D1 gave us bonus rep for wearing their exotic class item. Why can't we get that here?!
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u/allred7 Jun 08 '18
Forgive me if this is obvious, but when it says you must wear a "full set" of faction armor to get the renown buff does that mean all 5 pieces or does 4 comprise a full set due to an exotic piece?
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u/rwallac1 Jun 08 '18
I think faction ghosts should guarantee more tokens. Not an RNG chance of getting that perk that seemingly never works, but you get a bonus token every time you get some. And your ship should fly faster if you're wearing full faction armor (a guy can dream, right?).
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u/superbob24 Jun 08 '18
It should give more tokens for all content. Getting 5 stacks of renown in PVE is super easy. Doing 1 extra patrol or finding a HVT during the heroic event is super quick and way easier to fight the lost sector with an exotic armor piece.
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u/NathanMUFCfan Neon Nerd Jun 08 '18
Full faction armour should grant you more tokens from any activity that gives you tokens.
Also, there should be more viable ways to grind tokens, outside of public events and lost sectors. To be anywhere near efficient, you have to do those two or you're hurting yourself.
You should be able to play the game in pretty much any way you like and still earn a similar amount of tokens.
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u/IUsedToBeGoodAtThis Jun 08 '18
Faction rallies only serve to inhibit how you enjoy the game.
EVERY activity should be a viable grind. PVP shouldn't be less lucrative than PVE.
I would prefer faction tokens just 1for1 (maybe 2for1) replacing all other tokens while active. Balance the token economy if needed.
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u/Beastintheomlet Jun 08 '18
I completely disagree, Faction Rallies are something to do that's different than what you'd normally do. I thought the Renown was a good way to get people to explore the lost sectors.
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u/iAmWrythm Shohreh Aghdashloo is bae. Jun 08 '18
You mean there's more than the one under the church in the EDZ???
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u/xnasty Jun 08 '18
If everything is as good as everything else then the entire game feels completely flat and nothing feels like it has meaning.
I would like PvP token income to be spiced up, but I don’t want it equal to what you earn out in the world because then my normal playing routine doesn’t change in any way and rallies yet again feel pointless. Change up what I do daily please.
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u/pgriffy all the fun, none of the damage Jun 08 '18
Where is this faction armor you speak of? RNG has only blessed me with 2 boots and a chest piece.
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Jun 08 '18 edited Jul 15 '18
[deleted]
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u/pgriffy all the fun, none of the damage Jun 08 '18
Yeah. I didn't even do faction rally the last time. Just started back with warmind
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u/shokk Jun 08 '18
Got it all in season 2 along with the original ornaments. Can confirm I have that same boots and chest piece.
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u/Cr4zyC4t Jun 08 '18
Don't be a wimp, if you want Crucible integrated more, go all in. 1 kill nets you 1 renown, 2 with full faction armor. Cash out renown at the end of the match.
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u/xnasty Jun 08 '18
I’m imagining you don’t lose renown on death, but instead you only gain it with kill kill streaks and the end reward scales with your streak. 5 is 1-2, 10 is another 2-3, 20 gets you 5 and a cash out mid match.
Overly complicated though.
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u/Cr4zyC4t Jun 08 '18
Nah, +1 on kill, -1 on death. Power/Regen/Damage penalty and all. Kill someone? You're weaker. You died? You lost a handicap, and they got one. You went on a rampage and have 5 renown stacked up and still no one can kill you? Enjoy all these tokens.
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u/NinStarRune 2500 Done Solo Jun 08 '18
Full faction armor gives bonus renown tho
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u/Beastintheomlet Jun 08 '18
Correct, this post in regards to expanding the utility and event fun of wearing a full set of Faction armor to PvP as well.
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u/TelmatosaurusRrifle Jun 08 '18
the average pvp match takes 10 to 15 minutes. Tokens should reflect that at about with 10 to 15 per game/win. The same with the raids. A raid takes an hour to get through and is the endest game content. 20 tokens per leviathan section would be more fair than the 5 or so you get. Bungie should be less greedy with letting players win and allow more ways to get lots of tokens than just grinding the same lost sector again and again for ~1 token every minute of grind.
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u/Pikachu_OnAcid Drifter's Crew Jun 08 '18
Bonus tokens if you're using full faction gear (weapons; ghosts).
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Jun 08 '18 edited Jun 08 '18
[removed] — view removed comment
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u/Beastintheomlet Jun 08 '18
I queue solo for 90-95% of my matches. The remainder is me with one friend every once in a while. I don’t have nearly the problem with four stacks that many other do, I see them every few matches but they don’t really bother me. I assume a 4 stack playing quick play isn’t good enough to play comp.
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u/ParzivaI Jun 08 '18
I just hit level 15. I'm not going to make it to 50 in a week, and I'm not going to kill myself trying. The catalysts must end up coming back via another method. It can't be a one, and done deal.
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u/silverhandguild Jun 09 '18
I feel like doing well in PVE or PVP should award tokens. Things like “kill streak” in PvP, give em a token. Made ten orbs of light? Here’s a token. It’s should rain tokens in my opinion, like the rewards in Iron Banner at the end of D1.
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u/Masterchiefg7 Jun 09 '18
It should just net you more tokens period. You should get +1 per renown turned in. You should get +1/3 Or so for strikes and PVP. Etc.
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u/Freddie6295 Jun 09 '18
why not a renown system for crucible too, so you'd get a lot more tokens for winning a crucible match with higher renown but will have a harder time winning due to the renown itself If you lose a match your renown goes down by 1 but if you win it goes up, up to 5, and resets after you win with renown 5 There could also be an option to reset renown whenever you want kind of like a trials card so you don't have to be stuck at renown 4 doing lower damage or something of the sort
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u/AdrianChm Jun 08 '18
Technically, wearing the set DOES get you more tokens ...per hour or whatever time unit you choose. Can you grind tokens faster with the armor than without? Absolutely yes.
Having said that, I agree something is missing. Even +1 token to LS and +2 if ornamented would be nice.
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u/Beastintheomlet Jun 08 '18
I'm speaking specifically to PvP, where faction armor plays no role in determining your token gains.
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u/AdrianChm Jun 08 '18
Right. Here's me just reading the tittle and quickly glancing over the content. Sorry :) And you're absolutely right, should get extra PVP bonus. Might motivate some Hunters to drop the Wormhusk for a couple of days ;)
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u/Mephanic Jun 08 '18
While I agree with the premise in general, I'd rather not tie this to the armor itself, but to the emblem.
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u/ee4lif3 Jun 08 '18
That's not enough tokens.
The PE, LS grind will net you over 100 tokens per hour. That equates to over 1.5 tokens per minute.
By the same calculation PvP should be giving 15 tokens per game. As it stands it will take about 10 hours to grind to 50 doing PvE content and 40 hours doing PvP content. There's something really wrong with those numbers.
There shouldn't be a penalty for losing games with regard to tokens. It should be a flat 10-15 for a game, period. If they want to give another 5 tokens for having full armor, that would be a big plus.
As it stands this is another case of Bungie telling me how to play the game. I don't want to farm PEs and Lost Sectors. I've done hundreds upon hundreds of them. I want to do PvP. But 40 hours to reach rank 50 is straight insane and unbalanced.
I literally give 2 shi*ts if someone say's, "but the lore". It's a game. Balance the rewards between the events for special events.
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Jun 08 '18 edited Jun 08 '18
There is no reason all activities aren’t balanced around the same token per minute timeframe.
Typical Bungie not letting players play the game how the player wants to play it.
They know the average, median regular strike, heroic strike, Crucible match, patrol/PE pattern grind. These should all be set to drop tokens at same approximate token/minute played.
Make the token grind comparable so we can play the game how we want. The only slight gameplay specific items should be ornaments and those shouldn’t force PvP on anyone because PvP should never be forced on anyone ever except when dealing with PvP exclusive vendors and drops.
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u/xnasty Jun 08 '18
Disagree. I like having my normal routine changed up, otherwise the game feels flat and nothing feels unique at all during an event, it’s just another token slot machine put on top of my usual crucible.
Crucible should have a unique way to earn renown and thus tokens integrated into the actual match.
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Jun 08 '18
I definitely meant balancing around each system having it’s own renown type systems. Idk. Maybe if you hit 5+ kill streak you get Renown buff for rest of match and corresponding token extras.
Strikes could be tied to strike streaks of doing 3 in a row and/or maybe not dying or achieving XYZ activates the renown buff for next strike. Maybe strikes spawn 3-4 specific Yellow mobs that need killed within a minute upon first taking damage. Could be a fleeing mob that’s hard to hit?
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u/xnasty Jun 09 '18
I’m with you then! I want to see the renown concept get adapted to work for Crucible (or sure even strikes) in a unique way.
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u/jdharris941 Jun 08 '18
You just said it yourself, doing a PE and a patrol then a lost sector would most likely take less time.
But I do agree, they should add tokens to more activities, crucible like you said, because I’ve been avoiding milestones because of how irrelevant they are to token grinding. I might not be able to do all of my milestones if I don’t finish my levels today, so I agree with that. But most people would probably stick with lost sectors because it’s faster.