Fairly recent history of the KKK, they hated Catholics nearly as much as Blacks. They would always say they don’t want to take orders from Rome. They don’t like the idea of a Pope. I think many rednecks who consider themselves Christians are today happy to align with Catholics (esp. if they’re white), to be against Muslims, Hindus, Jews, or whoever’s bothering them on any particular day.
Can confirm, grew up in southern Bible Belt. Catholicism was for immigrants or to perform secret witchcraft.
And the reasoning explained to me by my southern Baptist preacher uncle as a child was that praying to Mary was blasphemy, and many other things the Catholic Church does was akin to "occult ritual." Baptising babies was especially heinous, they must CHOOSE to accept Jesus before they could baptized, a baby has no choice.
Meanwhile, he danced with snakes at undercover retreats to "test his faith in god" so... you know, just pick and choose what's acceptable, as usual.
I can only speak for the redneck Mormons I grew up with, but Joseph Smith detested Catholicism. The Book of Mormon called the Catholic church “great and abominable” and the “whore of Babylon”. Catholic kids in my high school were ostracized. I wish I’d stood up for them.
So did this person have influence then to literally just state an opinion and other people were just like “yeah that tracks, I’m going to be hateful because of one persons opinion?”
Short answer: yes. He exploited people’s desire for elitism. The fastest way to make someone feel special is to convince them that others are not. That’s how most cults are built.
For clarification, Joseph Smith was the founder of the Mormon/LDS faith, author of the Book of Mormon, and claimed he spoke with God, Jesus, and an angel, so he's not just "some guy" to Mormons. He's considered a prophet who spoke on behalf of God, so his opinions would be God's opinions.
Fundamentalist Christians have created American Jesus, he looks a lot more like Trump. It messes with their logic to think Jesus was about honesty, empathy and forgiveness because they operate in a world of hypocrisy and punishment. Catholic socialism is a threat to their sanctimonious "god is on our side" grift. There's a lot of preachers and leaders making a lot of money and they aren't gonna let some little blip on the map in Italy keep that grift from growing. Guess it's kinda come full circle because the Vatican didn't get that rich by prayer alone either.
They give vague reasons about Revelation talking about the whore of Babylon being the Catholic Church, but the real reason is that Americans are obsessed with individualism and Catholicism is a communal religion as opposed to a DIY religion like Protestantism.
The idea that Catholics aren't "real" Christians originated in Europe 500 years ago. The entire premise of Protestanism is opposition to the Catholic Church theologically and politically, and it is far from uniquely American. It is true that Anglo-colonialism here began with a fringe group of Protestants so thoroughly insufferable and intolerant that no one in Europe would abide them (the Pilgrims), so there is an argument to be made that there is a strain of deeply authoritarian Christianity that has particularly strong roots in America compared to elsewhere in the world. American individualism specifically, however, is only one part of a very complex picture. Indeed, American Protestants and Catholics are often broadly aligned in their belief in strict hierarchy and authority; just look at the Mormons, for example. They are a very high-control religion, and there's nothing DIY about it. I guess you could consider the fact that Protestants continually splinter off into a huge array of denominations "DIY" in the sense that worshippers can choose which one to follow, but those denominations are still often highly centralized once you're in them.
I was visiting my sick, elderly mother yesterday and her 'friend' came over to visit while I was there. Started hating on, and talking shit about a Catholic man I knew nothing of. They are Church of Christ, So it really boils down to everyone else is wrong and we are right mentality. Also they believe Catholics are idol worshippers, and not true Christians, I think? As an atheist from the US south it is wild. I just sit and go yes, eat each other and your 35,000 denominations of being Jesus's special cult.
Praying before idols (statues) and all the weird rituals they picked up from medieval paganism, the "pope" (not a thing in the Bible), nuns, confessions to a priest, all that stuff is basically made up or stolen from other beliefs.
But does his administration even need his followers anymore? They’re already in power, they could just say to hell with every underling, maga or not and make America a living hell
Once the followers turn, the executive won’t control the legislature… which is where Trump’s power is coming from. If JD takes over and doesn’t have a strong hold on the cult, things will fall apart for the Heritage Foundation plan.
The cult followers really do need a cult leader to worship for it to all work. No one in MAGA thinks JD is worthy of worship.
100%. This IS a cult completely built on a cult of personality - Trump. No one else can run it. Forget Vance, Elon, Desantis, or anyone else. It all collapses like a house of cards if he passes. Although they will try.
The only reason Trump is president again is because MAGA refused to support anyone who wasn't Trump, even before he officially announced his 2024 run. The only support any of them got was from non-MAGA Republicans, and they were far too split. The cult is Trump, it's always been Trump, and it'll always be Trump. The GOP may try to get one of his kids to run, but I don't see even that working.
They know this, and that's why they're going to use GenAI to create an immortal digital avatar of Trump for the unwashed masses to worship forever while Vance, Thiel, and others tied to the Network State make the actual policy decisions and run things in the background. The digital puppet provides bread and circuses to the cultists who would otherwise turn against them.
Yup. Trump tells the legislators what to do because he can get them primaried by his cult followers. Vance hopefully won't have such a rabid following, so the electorate will have more effect on their legislators.
Aahh maga influences the Republican Party in who to choose as Party Leader, but if DJT dies MAGA loses momentum, & their ability to choose a party leader shatters, republicans get more control over choosing a more center right party leader.
Yup. I suspect there's a big power struggle behind the scenes right now figuring out who will lead the party (and figuring out if they're just going to get their favored leader installed as VP and then 25th Vance for some BS reason).
Why would the executive not control the legislature? Republicans have the House & Senate. Are you saying the MAGA followers might stage a coup? JD won’t be able to rein them in and Republican support for the Heritage Foundation will fall and Democrats will properly challenge Project 2025?
Vance is a Yes Man, not any kind of leader. He's spineless (his wife has more balls than him), dumb, zero charisma, and brainless. He's the perfect puppet but the masses don't fear and adore him, which is why trump's power held.
They have no power without Vance. He's their key to the government. But without him in a position to be successful, they have no more power than they did before him.
Governments rule by the consent of the governed. That’s just how it goes. I’m not saying it’ll be revolution and uprising, but the masses have to go along willingly, (even if coerced). No government survives a loss of the people’s confidence.
And even MAGA, they are the supposed patriots and all for freedom and such. Once their messiah is gone, and that spell is broken, are going to be a lot less willing.
He had a 20 ft fence installed around the white house because he is a pussy! His gold white house shit is plastic sold at Home Depot! Gaudy and ugly af just like himself. Some people say some women have no standards if the wallet is big enough!
If the fascists try it, we the American people fight them on it every step of the way. In that respect, nothing will really change--47 keeling over from health complications would still be a net positive, either way. Don't cede them victories and powers that they don't have in advance when they haven't done the work to win the war and earn it.
I think that MAGA and the Christian Right, who have been organizing for the last 25 years will not go away, and Frump will become a martyr. But the coerced business people and the scared 'normal' republicans will be able to get back choice, which they currently do not have. Frump has stepped on lots of toes, and people are pissed off. A lot will depend on whatever basic sanity is left in the R party.
After that my crystal ball is closed down, except a divided US is an excellent target for our iinternational competitors, and we simply do not have the financial resources that we once did, and we no longer manufacture stuff, and we barrow a lot of cash.
A martyr is a very powerful force, look at Christianity. Certainly the winds are blowing!
Everyone said the same thing about Nixon, Reagan, the bush’s.
Everyone said the same thing about 2016, and Jan 6, and election 2024. Everyone is continually shocked that nothing stops the cult. But it’s not Trump. Its heritage foundation.
They just need to gridlock blue regions with ICE checkpoints on Election Day. They don’t need to stop the election or rig it. They just need checkpoints at highways and bridges that make rush hour last until 9pm. Then no one makes the polls and gerrymandering fixes the outcome.
And that’s why they are trying to make absentee and early voting illegal.
Everyone is acting like that’s impossible. Nothing is impossible. Look outside. Revolutionary
War, a civil war, and World Wars couldn’t stop the US from having access to international postage.
Republicans just broke the international postage system for the US yesterday. Only private freight is shipping from 20+ major countries. Republicans did it without a single fight. Just tariffs.
Well, they can't exactly make it illegal, since the states run their elections, not the federal government. But what they CAN do is make it as difficult, cumbersome, annoying, intimidating or just as generally as much of a pain in the ass to vote as humanly possible. And we're already seeing them trying that.
That's why Newsom's push to gerrymander on the blue side and all these left-leaning local election wins like Mamdani and Seattle's mayor and that judge election that Elon tried and failed to influence are so important. In order to take back our government, we need a strong political foundation to build off of. The Republican party understood that, that's why their political project from Reagan to now has focused so much on local politics and it's why they've been winning and are now feeling bold enough to proclaim it.
The question you've got to ask yourself is, has the American Left and the center-right leaning Democratic Party learned this lesson well enough to, as you put it, "make the impossible become possible?" I still think it's too early to tell, but I'll take the good signs and good news where I can find it, and the local/regional leftist wins and Newsom's aggressive posturing in the gerrymander conflicts both seem to me to be at least a somewhat encouraging sign. There's still a lot of mileage left to go in this marathon however, so I would agree that we can't let ourselves get too complacent.
So you think it is The Heritage Foundation as in who specifically? Evangelicals? So it the evangelicals and their vote that is the backbone allowing the whole MAGA cult to have influence and empower DJT….
Vance will never hold MAGA together. It's a cult of personality. But that doesn't mean the people will get their country back without a fight. The regime intends to end democracy no matter which stooge is in charge
True! But Paul is not seen the same as Jesus in American Christianity. Paul is seen as a wise prophet and Jesus is seen as GOD. MAGA sees Trump as GOD incarnate. They might accept JD but I don’t think so.
Re the biblical comparison--evangelicals I grew up with always sort of saw Paul with suspicion because he had a "conversion." He is always an "outsider" in the Sunday school lessons I was forced to attend. So, there's that -- maga doesn't truly trust "converts" and JD "trump is America's hitler" is a "convert" to their lord and savior.
this this this. I'm not getting my hopes up that he's dead in actuality but when it happens it's the end of an era. Vance can try to capture the MAGA energy, and I'm sure he'll have some followers, or default conservatives, but he will not command a crowd and have the people's respect, by default like Trump seems to. things can obviously change but i just don't see him capturing the spirit of what Trump has done.
JD is about as charismatic as wet lettuce. Plus, I doubt Trump would pick anyone that people might also like; Mr. Popular wants all that attention for himself.
Joseph Smith was a holy figure head for the Mormons. When he died, they found new leadership. Because Trump heads the GOP and not the Church of Trump, I'm certain they'll slot in whichever hate monger hates the best. MAGA's one true god is power by way of white supremacy, and that's been here since the founding.
You may have a point about MAGA ultimately caring most about white supremacy. There are stages of grief and they may get over losing DJT & band together on their commonalities …that would take dedication tho.
JD Vance and Musk will use GenAI to create an eternal digital avatar of Trump that speaks and moves exactly as he did, and can no longer die, calling it now. They will fool millions and use it to leverage power by saying he's still in control of the White House thanks to this "miraculous technology", when it will actually be used as a puppet for Vance, Peter Thiel, and the rest of the Network State.
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