r/AvatarMemes May 15 '25

ATLA I don’t feel like this is talked about enough.

Post image

Yes, from this interaction we can tell that Zuko is caught off guard with Aang being a kid. What this ALSO MEANS is that Zuko fully expected to be having a fight with either a fellow teenager or an adult Avatar.

My guy gets clowned on repeatedly by a kid and yet thought he could take a teen or an adult?!

8.3k Upvotes

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2.7k

u/ChuckFinnley3565 May 15 '25

When Zuko arrives he asks all of the people there where the 100 year old avatar is. He points to Gram-Gram and says something like, “he’d be about this old.” Bro was expecting to knock the dust off some old fossil.

900

u/JA_Paskal May 15 '25

Didn't he read his history books and know Kyoshi lived for over 200 years? Was he stupid? (Yes)

814

u/NickSchultz May 15 '25

No, quite different in fact. The creators messed up Kyoshi's age and it only got canonized later on.

Still Zuko was expecting to fight an adult (if elderly) fully actualised Avatar. It's very likely Zuko trained knowing it might not just be very unlikely but almost impossible to win. Zuko came ready to die to regain his honour.

And this only gets more poignant now that we know Avatar's can age into their hundreds without showing any signs of aging.

190

u/Mocahbutterfly May 15 '25

They came up with a story where she discovers how to keep herself from growing old.

129

u/seapeary7 May 15 '25 edited May 15 '25

Yeah, which isn’t retconning, esp if it isn’t a standard for all avatars. Zuko wouldn’t assume all avatars, esp in this age, would have the ability to prolong their lifespans if only ONE historically powerful and renowned avatar from multiple cycles ago had that power.

In fact, I believe every known Avatar has displayed a signature power or metaphysical resonance tied to their birth element—not just their role in the cycle. Roku, a Fire Avatar, initiates change and dies transforming a volcanic eruption—a literal alchemical death. Kuruk, the Water Avatar, is most spiritually connected and fights unseen spirits—Water being memory, reflection, the veil between worlds. Aang, the Air Avatar, is a nomadic diplomat—he ends wars through harmony, not domination. His element is movement, peace, and spiritual clarity.

The Avatar isn’t just a reincarnated hero. It’s a self-correcting force, a balancing algorithm. And I think the natural-born element of each Avatar isn’t random. It reflects what the world needs to learn through them—what must collapse, transmute, or endure to maintain balance.

So if Kyoshi’s lifespan seems like a “mistake,” ask yourself—what’s more believable? That the writers messed up? Or that the myth corrected itself in real time through resonance?

107

u/No_Yak5313 May 15 '25

Yes, the writers messed up, but they caught themselves and made a dope story from it. Same thing with star wars and why grievous never met Anakin in the cartoons. Boss man Dave is a writing Beast

30

u/Guquiz Airbender 💨 May 15 '25

What do you think a retcon is?

19

u/QuidYossarian May 15 '25 edited May 16 '25

That's a retcon my guy. Retcon aren't inherently bad. Sometimes they're just there to help a mistake or explain something you hadn't thought of and that's okay.

4

u/seapeary7 May 16 '25

Broski even the OC didn’t call it a retcon, I was just backing it up by clarifying that canonizing a mistake isn’t retconning. Retconning would have been them changing the date to make it fit another narrative that didn’t support earlier versions of the story. This goes with the flow.

4

u/QuidYossarian May 16 '25

Absurdly extended life wasn't a thing until they accidently flubbed her age the first time around.

1

u/seapeary7 May 16 '25

A retcon is more along the lines of having Jar Jar never exist in future iterations of Star Wars because he was annoying.

3

u/annatar256 May 16 '25

The concept of a retcon isn't subjective... it's a defined idea defining a revision made to a piece of media/fiction.

That being said I agree I don't think this could really be considered a retcon since they aren't revising anything. They messed up her age and just went with that. Like when they decided Maul didn't actually die on Naboo, it's not really a retcon because it isn't contradicting previously given facts of the plot, just continuing with something we the audience didn't know or understand.

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u/QuidYossarian May 16 '25

Disagree

Rip

1

u/LukasSprehn May 16 '25

Nope. A retcon is always when you have one established fact and then remove or change it later. It’s never what you just explained. Which can be used to explain or remedy things. But it needs to have had that fact given before still. Nowhere was Kyoshi's age established before then.

0

u/QuidYossarian May 16 '25

Kay, you're wrong.

2

u/LukasSprehn May 16 '25

Will you please elaborate…? I did on what I was saying.

-1

u/QuidYossarian May 16 '25

I've already discussed it. I'm not laying it out again.

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u/pohlarbearpants May 17 '25

Earth is the element of stability and strength. Kyoshi's long life allowed for a stable, peaceful era. You're absolutely right.

1

u/That_Uno_Dude May 15 '25

It ain't that deep bruv

22

u/night_dude May 15 '25

This is my take on it. He figured he'd at least get an honourable death and his father would finally realise who his son was, too late to take him back. It's exactly the kind of wasteful, dramatic, hopeless thing a teenager would come up with. Source: was a teenager. (Though fortunately was not exiled after a duel with my father.)

2

u/KronprinzRudolf May 17 '25

It’s exactly what Faramir did in The Return of the King.

6

u/Tjam3s May 15 '25

I took this a slightly different way, where zuko's ego and hubris had him believing he had a chance.

The firelord on the other hand....

6

u/NickSchultz May 15 '25

Oh no the Avatar wasn't seen in a hundred years. Sending Zuko after him was meant to be a pointless mission. He couldn't just exile him so he gave the pretense of a mission but everyone knew this was an impossible task and a humiliation in itself to have Zuko do.

4

u/Tjam3s May 15 '25

Right, but with the caveat that if he was found (because he must be alive or else would have been reincarnated) he would have no shot and die anyway

2

u/ostiniatoze May 18 '25

"He's had a 100 years to master the elements, I'll need more than basic fire bending to defeat him" Zuko, legit hours before he plans to fight the Avatar.

37

u/[deleted] May 15 '25

[removed] — view removed comment

5

u/Correct_Doctor_1502 May 15 '25

She did, but she probably aged relatively normal.

Everyone we see over a hundred looks elderly

1

u/globmand May 17 '25

I still don't really understand what the fuck is up with Kyoshi

1

u/JA_Paskal May 17 '25

Creators fucked up the maths and accidentally made Kyoshi like 200, they ended up rolling with it and saying she mastered some kind of life-extending bending technique.

70

u/VulpesFennekin May 15 '25

He probably thought he was over prepared, if anything.

2

u/AEL97 May 16 '25

Never be too confident with old peopem in Avatar, even more if they have acces to earthbending, if they train they can use thst ability to extend their lifespan for hundred of years.

2

u/Icarusty69 May 17 '25

Considering that Bumi is over 100 years old and still one of the strongest earthbenders in the world at the time, I’m willing to bet that everyone expected the avatar to be pretty unstoppable even in their old age.

Zuko was some combination of wildly arrogant and grossly suicidal.

863

u/Mesajarjar_binks May 15 '25

Don’t forget in the second episode he beats Zhao in a duel. Zuko is no slouch but Aang is a legitimately powerful Airbender. He was the youngest airbending master ever including past avatars. Also Zuko had never encountered airbending techniques before. Kinda hard to train against techniques that have been lost for 100 years

387

u/Many-Activity-505 May 15 '25

I always felt bad for Zuko. He never gets to be some special prodigy like Azula or Toph, he doesn't get to be some plot armor chosen one like Aang, he just works his ass off for everything and can't measure up because plot

258

u/karczewski01 May 15 '25

thats why he gets his redemption arc tho, he had to be humbled before he could truly help team avatar. it can be hard to humble a child prodigy.

1

u/Good_Barnacle_2010 May 19 '25

And he really does help them all. Except maybe Toph. She never got to get a life altering journey and all that.

101

u/[deleted] May 15 '25

I mean, beats a fire bending master and military leader fair and square in episode 2. He solos groups of fighters several times throughout the series, and he does eventually beat his sister. He's a powerhouse in his own right. He trains under Iroh, one of the best fire benders in the world and a high ranking member of the White lotus, then also trains under the sun warriors. Then he goes on to be Fire Lord.

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u/Continuum_Gaming May 15 '25

When he’s not being compared to some of the strongest benders ever, he’s actually a certified badass. There’s also the important note that he doesn’t only focus on bending, he’s a martial prodigy as well. The Blue Spirit was like a bogeyman at one point because of how good he is.

43

u/Altruistic-Poem-5617 May 15 '25

I always forget that zuko can handle himself just fine without bending. Most other fire benders are absolutely useless during an eclypse, but not zuko.

13

u/zbeezle May 16 '25

Dude was trained by Piandao, and we all know that Piandao doesn't take students with no potential. Zuko was just always compared to his sister, who was like the Albert Einstein of firebending.

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u/Desperate_Will_6629 May 15 '25 edited May 15 '25

I don’t understand why people always make this statement. Maybe in the original series he’s not portrayed as an exceptional bender or anything but by the time of the comics he’s literally shown to be a master, displaying feats never seen by any other benders & being able to go toe-to-toe with a sane Azula.

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u/GoodAtJunk May 15 '25

Because a lot of people (including me) haven’t read the comics

28

u/apple_of_doom May 15 '25

He's also like genuinely one of the most skilled trackers, infiltrators and sword fighters in the series as well as being no slouch when reduced to just throwing hands. Zuko is a very multi talented person.

3

u/ItIsYeDragon May 15 '25

He becomes the Fire Lord though.

2

u/[deleted] May 15 '25

So the Boyle of avatar?

2

u/TheCherryPieIsALie May 15 '25

Tbh, comparing Zuko to Azula almost isn’t even fair XD. If you don’t compare him with his sister, but just look at his skills in general, he’s still quite the remarkable firebender. Especially after he learned from the dragons. + He’s really good w the dual swords too!

2

u/RambleOn909 May 15 '25

Despite the fact that he IS a prodigy. 💔

1

u/RS10-08 May 15 '25

Sometimes not being special is special enough.

1

u/Ok-Supermarket-3211 May 16 '25

Same. He didn't even get to have his W over Azula.

1

u/Injured-Ginger May 16 '25

The guy is a literal teenager who can win against multiple fire benders in training and beats a much more experienced master in a dual at the age of what 16? On top of that, he is a master with broadswords. They definitely act like he's not a prodigy, but not amount of hard work would make you a master in multiple disciplines as a teenager if you don't have enough natural talent to be considered a prodigy. He might look mediocre next to Azula, but that's not exactly a fair measure. Also, despite his statements, even Azula worked hard. When she's demonstrating lightning bending, a hair falls out of place and she insists on doing it again. Azula was just more of a prodigy.

I'm not by any means belittling his hard work either. He shows a lot of discipline and trains constantly, but no amount of hard work will make you as good as he is as fast he got there. It's not like thousands of other fire benders wouldn't train sunrise to sunset and become masters of that's all it took.

1

u/themanyfacedgod__ May 18 '25

Zuko is 100% a physical prodigy. His strength, agility & endurance are much greater than the average person's. Plus he's a master swordsman at what? 15? 16? Definitely a prodigy. Just not a firebending one.

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u/DerMitDemLangenNamen Waterbender 🌊 May 15 '25

Also Zuko had never encountered airbending techniques before. Kinda hard to train against techniques that have been lost for 100 years

I think this is also true for basically everyone Aang encountered (except for Bumi probably?). Even though Aang is a master, not knowing how to fight an airbender is surely a disadvantage in his favour.

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u/Mocahbutterfly May 15 '25

Anng’s endling status combined with the fact that he hasn’t interacted with anyone in 100 years meant that most people wouldn’t have the knowledge or experience needed to effectively take down an air bender.

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u/DramaticAd7670 May 15 '25

True. But he also get clowned on by Katara as well, a novice water bender at the beginning and skilled water bender by the time she reaches the North Pole. This techniques AREN’T lost to time. So my guess is that if it is firebending, Zuko has experienced but outside of that…

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u/Mesajarjar_binks May 15 '25

Katara only beats him once during a full moon after she’s already started training with Pakku

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u/No_Procedure_5039 May 15 '25

And he was halfway frozen to death in a blizzard after he beat her that morning.

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u/Fabulous-Present-497 May 15 '25

Also, doesn't waterbending counter firebending ?

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u/DOOMFOOL May 15 '25

To an extent, but fire can also evaporate water and melt ice so it’s not a one way thing

-10

u/catgirlfighter May 15 '25

That's not how martial arts work. Fire arts supposed to be the most powerful too.

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u/Incomplet_1-34 Waterbender 🌊 May 15 '25

It is how fire and water work, though.

-4

u/catgirlfighter May 15 '25

Yeah, but not martial arts. And we're talking about about people hurt, not dousing fire. Martial arts imply ways to mitigate obvious weaknesses. And water dousing out fire is way too obvious for a weakness, so there is no way it could be unaddressed in a martial art. Especially for a most warlike nation.

1

u/Incomplet_1-34 Waterbender 🌊 May 15 '25

So in other words, you're saying it would obviously work so it can't work?

The presence of martial arts doesn't mean every weakness is null and void.

-1

u/catgirlfighter May 15 '25 edited May 15 '25

Water doesn't magically deal more damage to a fire user, as well as water user doesn't take less damage if doesn't protect themself, and fire user CAN mutually block water with fire. Because they are HUMANS, not POKEMON (suspend the fact that they're humans that spit fire or whatever).

About the weakness - if a boxer would fight a grappler boxer would obviously avoid grapples. And streetfighting boxer would be wary of leg swipes.

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u/Incomplet_1-34 Waterbender 🌊 May 15 '25

A firebender's main weapon and main defensive tool is their fire, a waterbender's is their water. And water puts out fire.

I never said they would magically be hurt more or less by the other's element. A fire user trying to make a shield will be very easy to deal with to a competent waterbender, and when having a direct confrontation of their elements, a waterbender will usually win.

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u/EnergyTakerLad May 16 '25

The biggest Crux isn't how skilled Aang is (though its part of it), its that no one in 100 years has seen an Airbender. Like you said, hard to train against a technique thats been lost for 100 years. Its wild how often fans overlook this very important fact. It's literally why Aang gets away with half the stuff he does. Atleast for the first season or so.

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u/memecrusader_ May 16 '25

*third episode, not second.

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u/thekyledavid May 15 '25

What was Zuko supposed to do? Go home to daddy and say “This task is too hard, just let me back in the family”?

He knew he was fighting a losing battle, it didn’t matter to him. He was fully expecting to fight an Avatar who was over 100 years old and was already a master of all 4 elements, but in his mind he had no choice but to pursue the Avatar with everything he had

If I offered you a billion dollars if you could throw a Shot Put ball 23 meters, you’d know that was a nearly impossible task, but you may as well at least try it, what have you got to lose?

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u/Jackal912 May 15 '25

To add to this, it goes deeper. It’s “a billion dollars” but also you aren’t allowed to have any other job until this one is done.

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u/thekyledavid May 15 '25

And you aren’t allowed to go back to the only home you’ve ever known, or speak with any of your family except the 1 guy they let come with you

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u/Jackal912 May 15 '25

Talking about it really makes me realize how screwed his life was at first. Can’t even go home to see his girlfriend or anyone.

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u/Noremac1234 May 15 '25

I love Zuko but he just loves biting off more than he can chew.

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u/DramaticAd7670 May 15 '25

Well he did go picking a fight with Katara…in the North Pole…during a Full Moon…

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u/Noremac1234 May 15 '25

Or every time he tries to fight Azula in season 2.

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u/apple_of_doom May 15 '25

When he was half freezing to death from dragging Aang through a blizzard

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u/agentofmidgard May 15 '25

He also tried to steal Appa

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u/ICareBoutManBearPig May 15 '25

But he doesn’t? The problem is power scaling. Against team avatar or Azula he gets outclassed. But whenever he fights anyone else he wins. And handily.

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u/Terlinilia May 15 '25

I mean, Zuko regularly beats grown men with his bare hands. Aang is just built different.

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u/Chale898 May 15 '25

NGL....they were both too young for this shit (being unconscious in an iceberg for a century doesn't count).

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u/ICareBoutManBearPig May 15 '25

It’s a great little moment because it world builds SO effectively. The villain doesn’t view himself as a teenager or a child because he’s been conditioned by this war to grow up. All of them have. Yes it’s surprising that a 100 year old avatar is just a kid, but Zuko also being a child soldier is so perverse. Yes Zuko actually COULD take on an adult. He literally does the very next episode when he defeats Admiral Zhao in an Agni Kai. In this world with this war being a child is not a possibility. Aang being a child brings back hope. A world in order where BEING a kid is actually possible and this scene sets up these stakes perfectly.

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u/Luciano99lp May 15 '25

Zuko fully intended on 1v1ing a 100 year old ancient sage master of all 4 elements. He is also incredibly arrogant and naive at this point in the story.

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u/tcodes27 May 15 '25

Well, what about Zuko? He’s just a teenager.

4

u/DramaticAd7670 May 15 '25

Exactly. After getting his shit rocked by an adult, Zuko went looking for the Avatar to have, essentially, round two in the worst case scenario

6

u/Aggravating-Bid346 May 15 '25

He even says at the start that he expects the avatar to be over 100 years old and just in hiding. Thats why he insists that Iroh teach him the advanced set instead of just firebending basics.

Side tangent: Personally I've always thought Zuko was a better swordsman than a bender. His skill against Jet in Ba Sing Se, when he had to hide his bending, and the time he broke Aang out as the blue spirit, show he's actually really capable when he's not using his bending.

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u/Traumatized-Trashbag May 15 '25

We should all not forget that Aang is the last of his kind. Anybody who has seen an airbender in action has got to be pretty old by now. I doubt Zuko was taught much in how an airbender fights, given the pride of the fire nation likely dismissing the need for such information.

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u/NO_FIX_AUTOCORRECT May 15 '25

Zuko is seen defeating multiple adult firebender soldiers fighting him at once.

Zuko was exiled because he challenged a GENERAL to a duel. He lost to his father, who he didn't really fight.

He is extremely confident and from what I can tell, only considered his sister, father, and uncle to be stronger firebenders than himself.

He absolutely embarrasses Sokka, a teenager, without even seriously firebending at him.

He defeats Zhao in a duel.

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u/DramaticAd7670 May 15 '25

I’m not saying it is an unwarranted assumption to fight an adult. Just pointing out that “big scary son of fire lord” is constantly trolled by a kid.

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u/lynnyfox May 15 '25

“What up, I got no depth perception and I’m here to fight god!”

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u/Y_b0t May 15 '25

Yes, he was. Even as a teenager, he might be the fifth best firebender on the planet. Also, he wasn’t expecting a teenager or adult - he was expecting a 100 year old cowardly relic.

Plus, Aang is an excellent airbender, a discipline that Zuko has never faced.

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u/Hugoku257 May 15 '25

At this point he had not been, he had only once been humiliated, and that was an adult. I think he projects his anger towards his own youth and the powerlessness he feels towards his father here.

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u/MinecraftIsLife12345 May 16 '25

while the line is a joke, it shows the reality that kids are fighting adults' wars

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u/Dark_Storm_98 May 15 '25

Considering it's been 100 years since the air nomads were wiped out

He was expecting either an over 100 year old airbender or a 100 yewr old waterbender

2

u/Frequent_Dig1934 May 15 '25

Fwiw he did one-shot sokka without breaking a sweat. Granted, this was back when sokka was mostly comic relief, in season 3 they probably would've had a real duel, but still i can't blame zuko for thinking he was ready.

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u/greenhairdontcare8 May 15 '25

I don't think we talk about how much zuko legitimately got the shit kicked out of him in the early seasons. Makes sense because the boy is basically held up by spite, anger and testosterone, but still DAYM

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u/samosamancer May 15 '25

I just love Aang’s perspective in this moment and other similar ones. That’s what stuck out to me.

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u/Anxious_Muscle_8130 May 15 '25

he wasn't expecting a teenager at all; he fully believed he was about to fight a 100+ year old.

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u/AXBRAX May 15 '25

He thought he would take on a 112 year old fully realized avatar.

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u/Disastrous-Monk-590 May 15 '25

He was also expecting him to be a fossil that could barely move

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u/No_Awareness9649 May 16 '25

“Training” arguably. “Meditating” cap.

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u/Useful-Put1111 May 16 '25

Honestly, it's my favorite season 1 joke lol

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u/Ryuukashi May 15 '25

Yup 😂 I wrote a whole what-if fanfiction about it. The first chapter is this interaction, and it does not go the way Zuko expects

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u/SnooPears3463 May 15 '25

They're really both just kids like what 2 years apart even tho aang looks 6

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u/ChildofFenris1 Firebender 🔥 May 15 '25

To be fair her would be an adult if he wasn’t frozen

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u/GrizzlyPeak72 May 15 '25

How is this a meme?

1

u/AsiaHeartman Waterbender 🌊 May 15 '25

He thought he was gonna fight a 100 yo+ old ass crusty ass man who was, at least, a master of two elements (air and water). Zuko is a great bender for his age, BUT Aang was raised in a very positive environment that gave his skills the room to grow, becoming an airbender master himself at just... Idk 12? He's 12 right? Zuko gets bodied by Aang because his skills got honed in before his traumas, Zuko was always raised in a hostile environment where everything that was taught him needed to be useful for his survival.

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u/BreadfruitBig7950 May 16 '25 edited May 16 '25

Well yeah if a kid keeps clowning you it's obviously possible, as long as you think of yourself as capable of growth. As Zuko does.

Also, it's sort of him battling with Ozai's ideas. According to Ozai, because there are these talented peopel abroad who can grow powerful and challenge them, they must surround them when they are weak and control them so that they cannot grow.

So Zuko, in trying to challenge his father, is trying to beat a kid (someone less than him) who is stronger than him, so he can learn how to beat his stronger and older father. But he doesn't really recognize that despite his age Aang is much stronger than him, and he winds up fighting Aang's age rather than his skills.

Just like Ozai is doing to Zuko. And Zuko is seeing that methodology fail, in action.

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u/omar_2111 May 16 '25

I thought Aang didn't learn fire bending until season 3...

Yet he is dishing some serious burns right from chapter 1😂

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u/BlockedPuppy May 16 '25

Honestly, it makes sense from his point of view he probably believes that he has to capture the avatar, or he can never go home and if he abandons the mission and it gets out he would put a target on his back to be hunted down as a traitor.

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u/New_World_2050 May 17 '25

If zuko meditates why tf he so angry

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u/cheezitthefuzz May 18 '25

He was expecting the avatar to be 112 years old

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u/CauseCertain1672 May 18 '25

I think he was fully prepared to die there

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u/Any-Tourist352 May 19 '25

oh my gosh, every time he says that “Well, you’re just a teenager” it gets me cracked up the top-tier scene right there. I love it.

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u/Factory_Recall May 20 '25

Yeah, so unlike a subject of fascist propaganda to develop a superiority complex. Weird

0

u/Queer-Coffee May 16 '25

What this ALSO MEANS is that Zuko fully expected to be having a fight with either a fellow teenager or an adult Avatar.

No, neither of those. He was expecting to fight someone who's barely holding onto life at 100+. And he still trained hard because he knew that it'd be a tough fight. Idk what you mean by 'clowned on by a kid', we can clearly see throughout the show that the level of skill differs greatly between different people regardless of age.

0

u/theonlyotaku21 May 17 '25

Zuko still outlived him