r/RomanceWriters • u/Silent_Win_9763 • 12d ago
Beta readers
Where are we finding them? How much money can I expect to spend on them? My book is not even finished yet but I feel like I am so caught up in the publishing process that I’m having trouble focusing on much else. I know the first step is to just write the book, to at least finish a “dirty draft” as some would call it. I’m at 16,500 words and worried that I’ve wasted my time writing all of them and that no one will even be interested in my work. The perfectionist in me has such a hard time with just continuing to write and not editing as I go.
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u/Antique-diva 12d ago
Writing your first draft is never a waste of time. It is a vital part of the process that every writer must go through. You will gain confidence from it and feel like you've accomplished something when you get over that finish line.
I do not think you should get alpha readers at this stage (beta reading is actually reading a fully edited manuscript, while reading a first draft or parts of it is alpha reading). I think you should continue writing until the draft is done. Ask any writer, and they will tell you that a first draft is always bad. I would never let anyone read my first draft because of this. I don't want to send my unedited shit to anyone.
My sister used to be my alpha reader, but she read my second or third drafts to give me developmental feedback. Since then, I've rewritten every story she has read for me and made them much better. This is for a romance series I've been writing for years. I'm just now in the process of making the final edits and sending the manuscripts out to beta readers so I can know if they are as good as I think before I publish them.
If you want to grow in your writing, find yourself a critique group and learn more about the craft. But do not make the critique group your crutch that you need to lean on to get your draft done. A writer becomes an expert in their craft after writing 10 million words. This is a LOT of manuscripts, and then some more.
When I started writing years ago, I had a system where I started my day by reading what I had written the day before and fixing the glaring errors. Sometimes, it was so bad I deleted it and rewrote it. Only after that did I go on writing the next chapter, which I then read the next day. This helped me get over the feeling that the text was bad. I allowed myself to fix it once, but no more until the whole draft was done. Then I did a second edit directly afterwards before putting the story to rest and moving on to the next one.
This method helped me to write 2-3 manuscripts a year. My best year has been 5. I don't start editing a manuscript properly before 6 months have passed from the first draft. I need to have forgotten it completely so that I can notice the problems in it.
In the beginning, I needed my sister's help in this, so I sent my manuscripts to her after this first proper edit. Nowadays, I don't. I'm seasoned enough to know what's bad and what works. Now, when I write a manuscript, I don't do any fixing on it while writing. I don't need to. I also don't need to look at it after it's finished. I just put it on hold directly and then do the first edit 6 months later.
But I've actually written 10 million words now. My writing is on a completely new level. I've done my due diligence, and I've honed my craft. My first drafts are not complete crap anymore. They still need editing, but much less than they used to.
If you want to truly become a writer, write is what you need to do. I mean, you can stay on 20k words and rewrite them over and over again, asking people for feedback, and never getting anywhere, or you could just write it all and let it be crap until you finish. Worry about editing it later when you can see the whole picture.
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u/reasonableratio 12d ago
Wow, you wait 6 months from the first draft? That’s fascinating. I’m almost done with draft 1 and I have so many things I need to go back in and fix that are easier to do with a fresh mind — loose ends that didn’t get tied up, deeper character arcs, more foreshadowing. I feel like I’d need to produce at least draft 2 or 3 before it’s productive for me to let it sit for 6 months otherwise I’d waste 6 months just to have so much of it be low-hanging fruit I could have found immediately
Do you feel like that’s because your draft 1 tends to be pretty complete from that standpoint? If so, what does your working style tend to be like to get there—e.g. do you tend to fix things as you see them rather than getting through the draft itself?
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u/Antique-diva 12d ago
I’m almost done with draft 1 and I have so many things I need to go back in and fix that are easier to do with a fresh mind — loose ends that didn’t get tied up, deeper character arcs, more foreshadowing.
I used to need to do this. I edited my first draft once while writing it and a second time after completing it to fix these glaring errors. When I was done with that, I left it be and moved on to the next story. There was nothing I could do anymore, either because I didn't see anything more or because I was sick of the story and wanted to move on from it. If I left something unfixed, I wrote it down to remember later. I have big lists of fix this and that in manuscript No 6, and so forth. I use it when I open the said manuscript.
Nowadays, I've been writing for so many years, I don't have glaring errors in my first drafts. (I've written more than 50 long manuscripts thus far, some of it really bad, some of it very good, but mostly just normal stories). I have learned how to build character archs and write compelling stories. I barely fix anything now as I write my first draft.
The last manuscript I wrote was last year in July. I wrote 150k in 5-6 weeks, then saved it in my cloud and made a backup copy. I felt good about it, so I sent it to my beta reader who loved it and found no problems with it. I opened it again in February, when I had the time, and read it the first time myself. I found no big errors in it. I just fixed some spelling and did some line editing. I'm now posting it online chapter by chapter. It doesn't need any more work.
With my early work, I've edited them at least 10 times. Some of them are completely rewritten from scratch, others have had like 20 edits. And then there are manuscripts I'm probably going to delete in the end. They are so bad I don't even want to fix them. They just sit on my computer being a waste of space.
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u/lmfbs 12d ago
I've found most of my beta readers on various discords (usually with reciprocal swaps) - but really I think beta readers aren't so much your issue, it's the confidence. Finding a little tribe where you can talk about these feelings (and realise lots of us have them too!) can definitely be helpful.
I'd be happy to take a look at a couple of chapters if you like, I'm always looking for writing buddies <3
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u/Phyll-n-likeawriter 11d ago
Hello, I'm new to this world of online feedback and would love to participate in some reciprocal review of writing. I've been a member of local writing groups in-person and virtually for children's books, but I have not sought out a local writing group for romance novels. Would love to pursue this.
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u/paidbetareading 12d ago
Fiverr, goodreads forums, r/betareaders if you’re looking for something reciprocal (as in, you read someone’s manuscript and they read yours - this is free, but it can be hard to find someone with follow through, people can get ghosted there. Or get someone without much interest or knowledge of their genre simply because someone else really wants a beta swap. Gold can come out of there too though).
Be careful with paid betas - AI feedback is becoming more common, which is awful. You’ll know it when you get it, it’s unhelpful, generic, and the notes don’t really grasp your plot points.
Look for someone with a good reputation, fiverr reviews, feedback in other places. If you are willing to pay a premium - seek out professionals. There are people in the EFA (editorial freelancer’s association, https://www.the-efa.org) who do beta reading. That group tends to have degrees in English/publishing and experience within the field of publishing. You can search the EFA’s website for people who offer certain services (like beta reading or editing) and even search by genre of expertise for an ideal fit. You’re likely to get a much higher caliber of work there, and pay a premium for it.
But also? Finish your book! You don’t have to worry about all this until you get there. If you want someone to leave notes on something before you finish, this is actually called an Alpha read, and is less common.
But truthfully I don’t think it’s worth worrying if your first draft is “worth continuing” or not.
Your first draft might not be good. It’s not necessary for it to be. First drafts of published books you have read and loved were often not particularly good. The job of a first draft is to get all the ideas on the page. Then you refine them. That refining step is really the most important part of writing.
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u/reasonableratio 12d ago
I’m only just about done with draft 1 so I have a ways to go before I pull in beta readers but I’ve been keeping a tally of different places to readers from. All of them romantasy readers—basically tapping into my own network and going one or two relationships removed so that they don’t know me at all.
- I have a local friend whose friend I don’t know does intense reviews on goodreads that I want to tap
- I have a friend across the country who is in a local bookclub so tapping one reader from that
- I’m in a fandom discord where there are very active romantasy readers (it’s a romantasy discord), I’ve never talked about my novel so tapping someone from that
The idea for me is to get people who don’t know me, are really into my genre, and live across the country/globe
Not sure about payment yet—I’m thinking $250 per person? And try to get 6-8 or so.
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u/paidbetareading 12d ago
$250 is a solid bit above the average unless your book is hideously long.
Although it’s laudable that you want to compensate people on that level.
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u/reasonableratio 12d ago
Yeah I haven’t done any research on the pay range for beta reading, so I just started with numbers that would make it worthwhile for me personally to read through and give extensive feedback on a book that might suck lol.
That’s part of the upside of going through my network for readers too where it’s more likely they’d read it thoroughly and critically, which is worth compensating fairly. If it were complete strangers online I’d definitely not be comfortable paying as much, even in installments—you just never know
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u/paidbetareading 12d ago
Yeah it’s good that you have a network like that, and I hope it brings you good results!
Would say that if one is going to drop a lot of money on their book that a solid editor is likely more important than a large beta team, but. I think you’ll get good results from what you’re planning.
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u/JuneLeBlancAuthor 12d ago
I totally feel you on this one. Sometimes you just spiral and lose motivation because you aren’t sure if you are totally off base with your story.
One thing that really helped me was finding a developmental editor on Upwork. There you can find somebody with experience and have them read what you have and suggest/point out areas to focus on. My experience was good. She gave suggestions on character development, story pace and development etc.
This can be a needed confidence boost (hopefully) and, in my situation, really motivated me to finish my novel. The down side is that it costs a bit and doesn’t function like a swap might.
Anyway, good luck and I hope you can find a way forward thst works for you.
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u/TVandVGwriter 12d ago
You are psyching yourself out by focusing on the end product (publishing). A writing group might be beneficial to you, but you're not ready for beta readers yet.
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u/GinaCheyne 11d ago
Goodreads has beta readers and may have alpha readers as well but be careful, I’ve been caught by a couple of scammers there. If you look at the readers history you can usually see the scammers are recent additions. But I got caught, and I’m still feeling a bit sore about it. Even AI warned me that this might be a scam and I still went ahead. I’m an idiot, don’t be like me! I just hope I’ve learnt from the experience.
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u/charm_city_ 11d ago
You can ask a friend or two to "alpha read" for you. I do this by doing a rough edit of the chapter after I write each one and adding it to a google doc I share with them. For beta readers, that came after the book was done and I had done a piece together draft, a to-do list, worked through the list, then listened to the whole book (another mini list). I asked in a Facebook group for paid beta readers, paid $50 and got some good comments at the same time I sent the book to the editor. Then I incorporated the editing and beta reader suggestions at the same time. The other thing was to have a friend or two do a "cold read" after the proofreader and fix any mistakes they found, as well as any mistakes my ARC readers pointed out.
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u/walkicat 9d ago
My friends alpha read pieces of my first manuscript as it was in process, and then I used Instagram to find about 10 beta readers once my first draft was closer to a second/third draft.
Just focus on finishing the manuscript for the time being. The rest will come more naturally after it’s done.
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u/aabdelmonem 12d ago
This is a very common feeling, even if you’ve written multiple books. I still have beta readers look over early chapters to make sure they at least read well - and I usually don’t ask for critical feedback in those situations. Just the question of whether it’s interesting enough they’d want to keep reading. In fact, I just finished a manuscript that started out completely differently - I had written 9 chapters that a trusted friend read for me, and she gave me her no holds barred feeling. I needed to start over. Now, she and other readers have liked this new version. It was incredibly helpful, though I will say I had felt that the first version wasn’t coming together right. Having said that, I am also in critique groups, where I share new chapters for critical feedback.
If you don’t have a critique group, I would suggest going that route before beta testing. In fact, I’ve seen people on reddit looking for groups. I know “The Shit No One Tells You About Writing” podcast also does critique group match-ups (for a small fee). They are soo helpful. But if you do want beta readers, there are multiple paths to finding one. I’d start with friends and family who read - esp if they can be no holds barred with you. Facebook has beta reader groups you can join - many people in them are also writers, so often reciprocating is the payment - you beta read their stuff and they read yours. There are paid services but I haven’t gone that route.
But keep at it! Writing can be lonely til you find your people. Good luck!