r/TokyoGhoul • u/LK82Q • 2d ago
What is something people don't seem to appreciate enough in this manga?
For me it's the fact that it's so hard to make a top 15 best characters.
The second would be the fact that it has so many EXCELLENT arcs, normally other mangas have their "Pain Arc", or "Frieza Saga", or "Chimera Ants Arc", but in Tokyo Ghoul it's really hard to define which is the best arc.
And the last thing I think no one mentions is how at its lowest points (the later arcs of Re) it still has so many good things going for it, that it makes it hard to consider them bad arcs.
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u/Revalify 2d ago
I feel like maybe the beginning and end of Re. Getting into it I was told the beginning of Re was boring and doesnt pick up for a while and I feel like thats crazy cuz I was hooked right off the bat. And although the end of Re was rushed sure, its still amazing and has some of the best peaks in the whole series
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u/Low_Cartographer_701 2d ago
I think the thing about the beginning of RE is because most people don't take a break, for example, when they were in publication, since the first chapter was three times longer, there was a wait of a month, but with continuous reading, that wait isn't required and you go directly from that emotional ending... to the CCG investigations... yes, it's the same thing that happens to most people when they finish the Aogiri arc and instead of taking a break, they go straight to volume 9
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u/mamanSassanHaise 1d ago
This 100%. The end of volume 1 is so far from boring and meeting the Q's was one of my favorite things. Kaneki being this figurative monster for Haise was amazing and people said it was boring like HUH??? I just never understood how it was boring. I find it fantastic.
And to the other part, I actually loved the ending of re. I think it was a perfect send off. If you look at other manga, a lot are rushed to finish their endings and have horrible endings with so many loose ends like jujutsu kaisen. Ishida did his best with what he was given and unlike a majority of other mangaka he took nearly no breaks. Busting out the most amazing art and consistency weekly and unfortunately burning himself out but still wanting to give his characters send offs. How can anyone be mad at it? And I swear, people always talk about Tokyo ghoul having the best peaks and it's always the end of series- the world isn't wrong or just is, if I said I wanted to live a normal life you'd laugh wouldn't you- you already know. Sorry for ranting to your already obvious rant but I agree with you 100%
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u/Capital-Frosting-434 16h ago
Ishida is such a good author that even though the ending had some pretty glaring flaws with pacing, deus ex machina, a few characters having kind of unearned happy endings, etc. ... the parts that are good (Kaneki/Hide reunion, Amon vs. Donato, Kaneki vs. Furuta final fight, "the world is not right or wrong, it just is", happy Kaneki family with Ichika) so thoroughly outshine the bad parts that you hardly even notice. THAT is true skill.
I have read the ending of :re like 3 times and it still gets me in tears every time.
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u/Ill_Degree_2887 2d ago
The ending arc is great too. Just needed a few more details that will be cleaned up in the anime remake 😊 (it’s not happening 😔)
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u/Low_Cartographer_701 2d ago
fix the pacing and add a bit more world building, not necessarily that much, some details here and there about the extent of the true power of the Washu, a better introduction of the rare zombie quinque that I don't remember the name beyond being a diabolus ex machina, some in-depth information on Kaiko and... I don't know, put more emphasis on the conversation between Touka, Hinami and Akira, since it seems that many didn't quite understand why that conversation worked as a good conclusion to Touka's arc too, not just Hinami and Akira's…
And explain well how the hell the dragon works, since the closest thing to a theory that covers most of the holes are the answers in this post: https://www.reddit.com/r/TokyoGhoul/s/4Gf2mIBrPL
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u/CrateSonic 1d ago
And:
Make Touka and Yoriko reunite. The fact we don't even know if they ever saw or talked to each other again in RE is criminal. It could have been a really emotional reunion during the dragon war.
Keep Koma and Irimi dead. In RE they did nothing significant (that others could have done) and just died again, offscreen no less. TWICE. Them being alive kinda takes away from the consequences of Kaneki's suicide rescue mission.
Better, more in depth epilogue. Nuff said.
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u/Capital-Frosting-434 16h ago
Yeah it deserves a Bleach: TYBW treatment where the mangaka actually helps the anime studio out on fixing the flaws with the final arc to create something better than the OG.
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u/Ill_Degree_2887 9h ago
True but unfortunately I don’t thin ishida likes Tokyo ghoul. If anything he’d only wanna do a choujin x anime
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u/Conscious-0bserver 2d ago edited 2d ago
The fact that Ishida did exactly what he wanted to do with the story, even when there are times when it arguably made the story less enjoyable.
I think two good examples of this are how Kaneki became increasingly distant from Hide as he became more and more consumed by his ghoul-side after being tortured, and how Kaneki seemed to fade into the background as he became increasingly withdrawn during his time as the OEK.
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u/McReaperking 2d ago
I think the "readability" of the manga is really impressive, especially regarding how convoluted the fights can be at times.
The fact that you can so cleanly follow events with such minimal effort is a truly underrated skill and I don't think there is another mangaka/comic artist that does it better than Sui Ishida.
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u/Low_Cartographer_701 2d ago edited 2d ago
Aside from the ending, (they paint it like shit but it's still better constructed than the endings of a lot of mangas being even good despite everything. Not perfect, but good) I would say that each character had their importance at the story or narrative level Including the tertiary characters, which is usually a complaint because Tokyo Ghoul has too many semi-relevant tertiary characters… except for Mougan who only served to face the devil ape, make a cameo from time to time in RE and become a monk, I sincerely believe that Ishida's original plan was to use him for Ui's character arc because of how they conclude together, but that idea was left in the trash.
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u/LK82Q 2d ago
I swear I started Tokyo Ghoul expecting the ending to be garbage because of how people were talking about it, but I ended up being fascinated when I read Ken's conversations with Furuta and with himself before killing Rize.
It may not have been perfect, but Re's ending feels like a 7/10 at worst and a 10/10 at best.
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u/Low_Cartographer_701 2d ago
Yeah, the most popular opinion I see is that the ending isn't tragic. I mean, the complaint isn't that no one dies but that it isn't tragic and it's like... then RE would have been unnecessary because
it literally goes against Kaneki's character arc in RE (I don't know, I separate them with the obsession with power in the original and the desire to live in RE)
well, if you read the original, I think you already know how it concludes and why it would almost be a copy and paste of that one
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u/bestbroHide 2d ago edited 2d ago
:re 143 is legitimately one of the best showcases of manipulative meta writing in fiction
All the fucking clues in hindsight were there in the lead-up to Kaneki's most embarrassing failure. But everyone was so caught up in the very same hype Kaneki himself and those around him were caught up in. Kaneki was king. Kaneki was HIM. Kaneki is our savior. Kaneki is the ONE.
Nope. :re 143 was a grim reminder that Kaneki was a flawed human, the very basis of why he was beloved in the first place. And yet, because so many were caught up in the misguided high expectations of his character, they forgot about that, and many even flat out hated him for failing so bad. With others straight up ridiculing Ishida and his writing for ever making the main character fail tragically like that
What did Uta say in OG 143? "Tragedies just aren't popular these days." 143 chapters later, Ishida effortlessly proved that to be true.
The fact 144 kicked off with Kaneki's self-critic absolutely dogging him in the exact fucking way fans were trashing him 1 week before was blatant proof Ishida not only knew what he was doing, but proof Ishida read fans like a measly children's book
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u/sanguinemsanctum 2d ago
This story is one of the most unique and interesting takes on classical (vampirism) taken to the extreme in physical, mental, romantic and spiritual medium. Growth is explored in controversial methods thru magnificent art, and you can tell exquisite care was put into plot, character development, pacing, and delivery.
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u/mikewheelerfan 1d ago
The plot twist with Arima. I was spoiled on basically everything except that, because nobody ever talks about it! I was utterly shocked and I really wish it was discussed more in the fandom
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u/Sk8rboi__87 8h ago
Yes, but if more people talked about it then you (and many others) would’ve been spoiled on it, no? It’s better we keep that twist a secret for first timers so they get to experience it as the twist we did
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u/_Em_Bee_ 1d ago
The arc one is so true. I often tried to choose the best arc only to change everytime while reading the manga again. I am always like "This is the best arc" then the arc later I am like "No, this is the best arc".
At the end I gave up on deciding the best arc and it's thanks to this that I realized how much I like the series and why it's my favourite manga of all time
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u/Nangbaby 2d ago
There is a lot structurally that is masterfully done, but how Ishida created not one, not two, but three characters that not only inherited Kureo Mado's legacy but became decomposite characters while being their own unique characters is nothing short of amazing.
One of these days I'll write a long post about it. Not today,
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u/Open_Name_923 2d ago
Honestly the art. It’s so well done, every panel is just shouting with emotion and reactions.