r/climbing • u/Immediate-Fan • 4d ago
Mirror reality in Rocky Mountain National Park seems to have been vandalized recently
Does anyone have more info on this? Saw this tag next to the right hand start hold last night
138
u/Dangleboard_Addict 4d ago
/r/climbingcirclejerk has some explaining to do...
7
u/mr__conch 3d ago
That's a VB. Locking on a 45d edge to a throw to a jug finish? Lmao, get real grading this a V2 FA. Diabetes doesn't jack your grace up 3. Those crimps are generous, you had the opportunity to lock in the crimp. Maybe the sloper could bump to V1 but a V2 here is a huge stretch. The sheer amount of generous negative grabs after a tough move, lol. Even the overhang for a two move set doesn't push this into V2 territory. Rmnp climbers trying to grade creep, Imao
71
u/warisverybad 4d ago
im not sure if its just me having an old-head mentality, but these overdone memes actually making it out of social media are really annoying.
425
u/ieatpies 4d ago
This is why people from r/ClimbingCircleJerk are not allowed outside
194
27
u/julian88888888 4d ago
We’re not even allowed within 100 feet of a v2
14
29
u/Damnatus_Terrae 4d ago
Bro, why would I want to waste my talents on rocks when I can climb in a precision-engineered environment?
/uj ...that will never contribute meaningfully to the degradation of our natural spaces, unlike hordes of inexperienced climbers swarming the crags.
22
321
u/BeuysWillBeatBeuys 4d ago
idk man, it’s probably sidewalk chalk. it comes off with a splash of water. pretty funny imo and not worth getting twisted into knots over
153
u/hankbobbypeggy 4d ago
The pearl clutching in this thread is wild lmao. It's chalk on a rock. We tick rocks with chalk all the time. It is an absolute non-issue.
23
u/McGrathsDomestos 4d ago
Some people think chalk (say ticks more so than chalk on holds) is a breach of the LNT ethic. Logic doesn’t always come into it - I live near a man made quarry and people get pretty upset about various things there.
33
u/hankbobbypeggy 4d ago
I think it's silly. It harms nothing and nobody. If you make every stupid thing into an issue, people are going to tune you out when you raise concerns about actual issues.
15
u/Dear-Set-881 4d ago
I totally get what you’re saying in general but I will say that if you’re the type of person who likes figuring things out for themselves then a climb with all the “correct” holds ticked does kinda stink 😕 I’d put it on par with someone spoiling a movie. Is it the end of the world? Definitely not, but it can be kind of a bummer
2
u/Historical-Nerve7436 2d ago
You don't boulder outside much, do you? The ticks are often wrong, or don't work for your body type anyway. Outside, it's not finding the holds that's the tricky part, it's finding which crystal or bump on the hold is the good part. Just brush off the tick marks, even if they're perfectly placed you're not gonna remember exactly which crystal it was pointing to
3
u/McGrathsDomestos 4d ago
It doesn’t bother me in case someone picked that up wrong and couldn’t connect the dots.
5
u/hankbobbypeggy 4d ago
I got you, I didn't mean you personally, just the general "you." The way people in this sub are acting, this thing is going to mean the end of climbing in RMNP.
16
u/Damnatus_Terrae 4d ago
What's illogical about leave no trace? We just about hugged our national parks to death before that policy.
11
u/ProbsNotManBearPig 4d ago
It’s illogical to get super upset about a 0.000001% impact like this. LNT overall is great. Focus on the big picture though. This is negligible as a one-off offense.
5
u/DustRainbow 4d ago
Sure hope you don't climb outside if you take leave no trace literally.
-1
14
u/zhuangzi2022 4d ago
If people are going to flip on LNT about chalk then they shouldnt ever climb a prepared route. Moss removal is not LNT. contributing to the gradual polishing of rock isnt LNT
4
6
u/some_dog 4d ago
Better not to though. Leave no trace and all that jazz. Does impact access in some areas too. Seems minor and overly policed sometimes, but surely just easy to not do.
20
u/anteatertrashbin 4d ago
I agree that there are more serious problems in the world, but this is just shitty behavior from someone within our own community. they should know better
42
u/threepawsonesock 4d ago
If it’s paint, sure. If it’s chalk, it’s harmless trolling of inflated gym grading systems.
27
u/edwardsamson 4d ago
If it can negatively affect access, its bad. Full stop. RMNP park rangers are always fighting with climbers over shit like stashed pads. Why would we want to antagonize them more with shit like this? Its not harmless.
-22
u/hankbobbypeggy 4d ago
It's only bad if chalk is bad. Do you use chalk when you climb?
11
u/edwardsamson 4d ago
Tell that to the park rangers when they call it graffiti.
-11
u/hankbobbypeggy 4d ago
It's obviously chalk and if that park ranger is going to make an issue of it, they were going to make an issue of something anyway.
8
u/anteatertrashbin 4d ago
Those are some impressive mental gymnastics.
Of all of the things in this world to stand up for, you chose to stand up for graffiti.
-5
21
u/Joshiewowa 4d ago
Chalk has been banned places because of visibility issues, and RMNP is a sensitive place for bouldering-both in terms of the actual environment it's in, and the relationship with rangers
-8
u/hankbobbypeggy 4d ago
I get what you're saying, but you're acting like someone defaced some proud rock formation off a main trail, not 3 small words written in chalk next to a sit start nobody but climbers will likely ever see (that can be removed in seconds.)
11
u/tatxc 4d ago
That's such a silly thing to say. White chalk on holds which is used for a purpose and then at least attempted to be cleaned off is clearly significantly different from some garish pink nonsense written on the side of a boulder for no purpose. There's no way you seriously expect anyone to take that line of reasoning seriously.
1
u/discgolfer233 4d ago
Im going to have to introduce you to about 85% of America. They don't care to see a difference. Don't think people think like you. Big mistake. I learned that by caring about PFAS. People want an easy answer/convenience over what some silly guy on the internet cares about.
1
u/Damnatus_Terrae 4d ago
Most Americans actively hate the natural world. Doesn't mean we shouldn't protect it.
-3
u/anteatertrashbin 4d ago
i mean yeah, this is just a stupid rock out in the woods, but hold yourself and your community to a higher standard. this shit is ugly and degrades from the experience of being out in nature for everyone.
is it ok if i write some harmless trolling messages on your driveway? how about a cock and balls in chalk that will wash off with the next rainstorm in 3 months?
0
u/threepawsonesock 4d ago
Good grief. I apologize for not getting as worked up as you over this. It’s just not that bothersome to me.
You have as long as it takes me to turn my hose on to doodle on my driveway. Or at least to doodle while dry.
-2
4
u/hankbobbypeggy 4d ago
Lol, just brush it for 2 seconds like you would a tick mark, sheesh. It's actually less of an issue than tick marks, at least it's not showing you beta.
-1
u/discgolfer233 4d ago
They're doing it because they think they "know better".... I do occasionally have to agree with them.
0
u/PothosandGindontmix 4d ago
To be that person:
If it doesn’t rain for a few days the chalk can get baked into the rock and is very hard to remove.
3
u/a-stack-of-masks 4d ago
Is this an American thing? Here in Europe we use chalk for road and construction markings because they are easy to remove. If your rocks get so hot chalk bakes into them I don't envy you.
2
u/PothosandGindontmix 4d ago
Not American haha but roads are different to just the outdoors. There will be someone to come along and clean up the markings for a road who knows how long chalk can stay on a rock before it rains or someone comes to scrub it.
Maybe bake was the wrong terminology think more when you leave whiteboard pen on the board for ages and it gets ‘stuck’.
0
u/a-stack-of-masks 4d ago
Honestly we never sent people to wash off markings. It'll rain at some point. Also those markers cake together but are still pretty easy to clean off. I could see something similar happening if a solvent gets involved, but I'm struggling to think of anything that would dissolve magnesium and calcium carbonate without also dissolving most climbing rock or your hands.
I agree this is kind of a dumb joke but I don't see any difference between this and arranging a bunch of sticks to look like a penis from the right angle. It'll be there until someone gets bothered by it, then it's gone.
67
u/JDLRosa223 4d ago
I mean it’s a dick move for sure, but is this not just sidewalk chalk? It would just take a water bottle and rag to remove
21
u/VastAmphibian 4d ago
depends on what kind of sidewalk chalk. if it's the oil pastel kind, it's a bitch to remove. at least you can power wash a sidewalk.
60
u/its_tino_dawg 4d ago
What’s the difference between leaving white chalk behind and pink chalk?
26
u/Lazy-Cryptid 4d ago
From what I’ve seen, when people see things written out like this on rocks then it motivates others to do the same. However, not all of those people who decide to do the same may do it with chalk; they may use whatever they have available or even carve into it which is a lot more damaging.
0
7
12
u/Creative-Leader7809 4d ago
The difference is one is a neutral color that gets left as a side effect of appreciating the outdoors, and the other is a purposely eye catching dumbass message. LNT is cool.
-4
u/its_tino_dawg 4d ago
If it’s so cool I’m sure you scrub your chalk off your holds when you are done. Chalk color is irrelevant. It’s leave no trace not leave a trace is cool if it’s a natural color. We are all guilty.
10
u/Creative-Leader7809 4d ago
My friend, yes, you are supposed to brush off the holds if you leave a considerable amount like if you had been projecting. Otherwise we end up with more glassy crimps and sludgy jugs.
1
u/Winter_Whole2080 4d ago
White is at least a somewhat natural color for rock , but sure. Excessive chalk is an issue regardless.
-1
u/its_tino_dawg 4d ago
I don’t think the pink chalk is a great practice but this is literally a sub full of chalk smearing and leaving folks. Myself included.
6
u/lochnessie03 2d ago
I hate this because people don't understand that rangers and communities will actually limit access if this type of behavior happens frequently. Leave no trace is just how we show respect to the outdoor space. I have been approached by many rangers (in America) asking us to help clean the chalk and tick marks off (not left by us, we were just climbing in the area). When we actually talk to the rangers at some of these places, they do find these things to be of a nuisance. May not represent everyone's view, but it is their job to preserve things.
Also- the whole "V* at my gym" meme exists because of people's fragile ego and toxic mentality of grades. It's overused and people that actually say this often means it deep down. To write that on actual boulders outdoors is just extremely disrespectful. If you find it funny- you probably grade chases and tie your entire life achievement to climbing grades. Cringe.
11
u/TheSame_Mistaketwice 4d ago
Hi! Old-timer here. I've seen numerous crags and bouldering areas go through entire cycles of development, heavy use, falling out of fashion, regrowth, redevelopment, etc.
When I started bouldering, there were very few bouldering areas that saw traffic anywhere near the numbers that even small local areas are getting now (e.g. Bleau, Hueco). These places developed strict rules to mitigate the effects of the numbers. In the smaller areas, one cleaned chalk off the holds to be polite to the next person - we all wanted to figure out the problems ourselves, and we understood that hunters, birdwatchers, hikers, foresters, etc. all appreciated having an unspoiled view - both for crags and boulders. It was not about environmentalism, but about community.
As the numbers of climbers and boulders has increased, ideas about what appropriate behavior is has changed. It was considered rude not to clean the boulder regularly while climbing and especially when leaving a boulder. Recently I asked someone to do that, and they responded that it was the job of the person who arrived at the boulder to clean it before climbing. Leaving materials like pads, ropes, ladders, fans, etc., has seen a similar change.
This thread also shows that evolution in ethics. Obviously, many people see that as a positive change. I'm not convinced.
2
u/_LePancakeMan 4d ago
I'm not sure, why you are getting downvoted - as you said: we as climbers are not the only ones enjoying the outdoors.
I also do a good bit of landscape photography and having a 'tainted' rock in a place, that could look more natural sometimes just ruins the photo.
3
u/TheSame_Mistaketwice 4d ago
Hi! Thanks for the message. I think my post might be getting downvoted because it makes a critique based on my view of how things have changed over time. For someone who has only started bouldering in the past 10 years, this might be viewed as a personal critique. I tried with phrasing to avoid this: since newer climbers haven't even had a chance to experience how things were before, I can't blame them for following the current ethics, which allow for things like not cleaning off chalk marks.
Or maybe it's something else? Not sure.
34
u/walkinthedog97 4d ago
Thats fucking hilarious if its just pink chalk, still hilarious but not cool if its paint or something else.
19
u/Syllables_17 4d ago
Love how people be freaking out over this shit meanwhile they literally carving into rock in the creek.
Relax people
2
3
u/CaptCrush 4d ago
Yeah a bunch of people saying this is no big deal but this is exactly the ways we lose access to climbing areas. It's just unnecessary, leave your shitty jokes to online forums.
4
3
1
1
u/MrHeavySilence 4d ago edited 3d ago
We shouldn't normalize this and this is wrong, but I'm wondering how we as a climbing community justify bolting routes, that seems way more invasive than putting chalk on rocks. I don't even mean to be facetious or to take a stance on this. You drill into rock, that can disturb moss, birds like falcons, rare plants growing on cliff faces, etc. Both putting routes and drawing on rock are probably bad for the ecosystem. Climbing chalk is bad for moss and lichen too. I'm wondering what you guys think about this
7
u/Thirtysevenintwenty5 4d ago
Drilling holes isn't bad for the ecosystem. Developing climbing routes as a whole is.
You're right that climbers tend to gloss over the immense amount of destruction that goes into developing and "cleaning" a new route. Cracks are often full of mud and plant growth, slabby faces can be covered in lichen that takes decades, if not hundreds, of years to develop. All of this can be erased with a scrub brush in a half hour.
A bunch of the climbs in Yosemite have rare succulents growing on them that most people don't recognize or appreciate.
The tolerance of environmental impact of climbing is an arbitrary line that allows use of land for climbing, while trying to avoid any additional destruction. To a climber it makes perfect sense, but to literally anyone else it's pretty clearly cherry picking of environmental guidelines to follow.
1
u/Fit_Explorer_4295 11h ago
climbers are very pro-environment ...... when it's only non-climbers who are asked to make a slight sacrifice.
1
1
0
u/jcreature2112 4d ago
I climbed a bit in Italy this summer and labeling the grade at the base was common where we were, which was new to see. It looked permanent there, this looks like chalk. Maybe someone from Europe trying to be helpful haha?
2
1
u/TooPoetic 4d ago
I’ll see about going to do an investigation. Maybe we can find finger prints near by.
1
u/Nercow 3d ago
It's chalk...? Investigate what? Someone being annoying and unfunny?
1
u/TooPoetic 3d ago
OP was requesting more info on said chalk art. I figured it was worth looking for finger prints so we can hopefully catch the criminal!
1
-4
-2
u/LothCat1313 4d ago
Honestly hilarious. let’s remember climbing’s punk roots and take it in good humor
-2
-7
u/No-Letterhead-4407 4d ago
Climbers know better. They’re more in tune with nature. This looks like chalk and will come off quickly. Still unnecessary but definitely not worst case scenario
14
u/poorboychevelle 4d ago
Painting with a pretty broad brush there. Bouldering isn't as LNT as people might think
0
u/Ninetndo69 2d ago
Itd be nicer if people didn't write on the wall. If theyre gonna, they should at least clean it before they leave the session. But as long as it isn't permanent im only disappointed, not mad.
0
-8
273
u/space9610 4d ago
Is it pink chalk?