r/finnougric • u/Dismal-Elevatoae • Jul 18 '25

Ancient DNA solves mystery of Hungarian, Finnish language origins — Harvard Gazette

https://news.harvard.edu/gazette/story/2025/07/ancient-dna-solves-mystery-of-hungarian-finnish-language-familys-origins/
23 Upvotes

96% Upvoted

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6

u/Karabars Jul 18 '25

Yes, Uralics (with haplogroup N) came from Siberia

-3

u/mediandude Jul 18 '25

No, uralics came from europe.
At least 90% of uralics have always been in europe, the same can not be said of indo-europeans.

And uralics in the Baltics have always outnumbered uralics in Siberia and Asia in general.
PS. The oldest R1a found so far was found in finno-ugric lands, about 15km south of Kotlas.

2

u/Karabars Jul 19 '25

The language came from Asia. The fact that they assimilated Europeans won't change that, and R also came from Asia.

-2

u/mediandude Jul 19 '25

Uralic sprachbund originates from europe.
No consensus linguistc tree has been found. No tree, no branches, no branchings, no compact proto-home.

2

u/Karabars Jul 19 '25

So no consesus, but it's for sure from Europe... xD

Haplogroup N is the Uralic one, it's Siberian. All Uralic languages carry this Haplo and Siberian autosomal dna as well.

-2

u/mediandude Jul 19 '25 edited Jul 19 '25

Yes, it is for sure from europe by default.
Sprachbund is by default. And sprachbund is native by default.
Until consensus evidence would suggest otherwise. No such consensus evidence has emerged as of yet, so the default continues to dominate.

All Uralic languages carry this Haplo and Siberian autosomal dna as well.

That is not proven, yet. And hungarians don't carry it.
Estonians have very little of it. And latvians are apparently not tested yet. More specifically finnic curonians at Piemare.
The logical reasoning would be that any such siberian or Sakha genetic influence spread within the already existing uralic domain, it didn't spread that domain, it rode on it. Like an uralic Schengen space.

PS. The oldest R1a found so far was found in finno-ugric lands, about 15km south of Kotlas.

2

u/Karabars Jul 19 '25

Hungarians carry it, Especially the Conqueror ones, who carried the language here. Estonians are 37% N1c, this is the most common Haplogroup there. Just because you're not up to date, doesn't mean something is not proven.

Sprachbunds prove nothing. And the Uralic spranchbund isn't even European, as Samoyedic groups are part of it, who weirdly miss the latter mixing with Indo-Europeans.

Do you hate that your ppl came from Asia, or why this weird agenda that you keep parroting "oldest R1 was in Uralic land"... So? R haplogroup is Indo-European, that's why R2 is in "Indians/Aryans", R1a in Iranics and Slavics, and R1b in mostly Western Europeans. The Indo-European language was carried over by R haplogroup. The oldest R1 means little, when R, its upper, parent clade came from Central Asia. And it got split with Q (Paleo-Siberian, like Amerindians, Huns), while N split with the East Asian O.

Really weird that you join a finnougric sub just to go tinfoilhattery and on a quest to prove that Uralics just native Europeans :'D

Also every Uralic language carry autosomal Nganasan-like Siberian markers. Even Estonians and moderrn Hungarians. I'm did a dna test, I also have Siberian markers. I have a friend who is N-L1026 (Ugric branch), and I'm doing a research on modern Hungarian surnames and the y-haplogroups linked to them, and 4% is N. If you know Hungarian history (even if you ignore the fact that Conqueror Hungarians were proven to be 30% Haplogroup N, and 50% Uralic dna-wise, while known to be heavily mixed with Iranic, Turkic and Slavic groups even before reachign the Carpathians), you can know that Hungarians were almost wiped out twice, and the aristocracy heavily favoured non-pagans, often foreign Germanic settlers, like during the civil war between I. "Saint" Stephen and Koppány.

Do a dna test for yourself (or for your father if you doN't have an y-chromosome) and see what you have. And you can decide what's more important to you, your Asian roots as an Estonian, or whatever European dna you can cling to after thousands of years of mixing with actual natives.

0

u/mediandude Jul 19 '25

You are mistaken.
The bunch who arrived into Hungary was a weird mix, with no clear known distinction between ugrics and tatars and others.

Uniparental haplogroups don't show much, repeated generational epidemics sweeps can raise even a single individual's haplotype into dominance in less than 500 years without any military or linguistic dominancy.

And the Yakutian autosomal influence and uniparental N1a spread differently.

Just because you're not up to date, doesn't mean something is proven.

R1a is finno-ugric just as much as N1a1a, get used to it.
At least 90% of uralics have always lived in europe, the same can not be said of indo-europeans. Do you hate that your ppl came from Asia, or why this weird agenda that you keep parroting "R1a not uralic".

Also every Uralic language carry autosomal Nganasan-like Siberian markers.

No they don't. Latvians used to be finnic. Lithuanians used to be finnic. They have high frequency of N1a1a, but very little if any Yakutian autosomal component. Your logic is deeply flawed.

2

u/Karabars Jul 19 '25

Cope harder

0

u/mediandude Jul 19 '25

You should try more self-reflection.

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4

u/pr_inter Jul 18 '25

Title leaves out Estonia, oof

2

u/senki_elvtars Jul 18 '25

Interesting article, thanks for sharing

2

u/avataRJ Jul 18 '25

In case someone likes to watch in video form, I did yesterday run into this video on YouTube. Basically the same information as far as I can see.

2

u/disasteress Aug 03 '25

Thanks so much for this. Very interesting and seemingly well done description of Uralic languages/people.

1

u/senki_elvtars Jul 28 '25

Since you've posted it this article has been quoted in several Hungarian articles. It kind of went viral 👍