r/firelookouts • u/Such_Morning4459 • 15d ago

"social media lookouts" and government ethics

tiktok lookouts making money using their federal jobs as content, am I insane or is that extremely not allowed/borderline illegal?

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u/Such_Morning4459 15d ago edited 15d ago

Yeah that's why I asked because I'm not entirely sure of the rules concerning it. Also you're pretty off on that book analogy. The people on tiktok are literally filming a video of them reporting a smoke and then making a profit off said video. I promise you that violates some form of ethics and at the very least it's an incredibly bad look in this current fraud, waste and abuse era we're in

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u/Mysterious_Flight_ 14d ago

Could you link the video of them reporting the smoke? I can almost guarantee they either:

a. Were already recording, and it would've been a waste of time to stop the recording to call it in

or more likely

b. Already called it in, then took the video of the smoke.

Once a smoke is called in, there is nothing we can do but wait and watch. I dont post online but the first thing I do after calling in a smoke is absolutely pull out my phone and take videos/photos, both for myself (to compare to as the smoke grows) and to share with other lookouts (or friends and family, if they arent sick of my smoke photos). This is very common practice, at least among the lookouts I know, and I was strongly encouraged to do it when I was trained. What about it do you believe is unethical?

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u/pitamakan 14d ago

I knew this thread was going to get riddled with downvotes the instant I saw it ... but I think part of the problem is how one defines "ethical." Monetizing content created as part of your job may or may not violate one's personal moral compass, but that's not necessarily going to be congruent with the federal government's published regulations regarding workplace ethics. Those regulations specify that you can't use your position title, official workspace, or government equipment as part of a monetization effort. Any lookout that is monetizing their content is in pretty obvious violation of those regulations -- and those guidelines are a part of their conditions of employment, which they agreed to when they took the job.

Obviously, that's not to say that you can't shoot photos or video while working -- that's part of the job. And that doesn't mean you can't responsibly share it. You're just not allowed to build a side gig out of it, which is what some of the TikTokers are doing.

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u/Mysterious_Flight_ 14d ago

I see other federal workers posting content that violates that all the time, so I'm assuming its just not enforced whatsoever. If you search "Day in the life of a nurse/EMT/police officer/park ranger/firefighter/social worker/etc" you will find thousands of videos on tiktok of people sharing their job and lifestyle. If its not enforced for them, I dont see why it should be for lookouts

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u/pitamakan 14d ago

As I tried to explain, in the eyes of the US federal government the issue isn't with posting content, it's monetizing content. Federal employees post photos all the time, and as long as they're not sharing confidential material or doing it to earn extra money, that's totally fine. (Our government actually considers all employee photography performed during work hours to be public domain material.) There obviously has to be a line somewhere, though, and for a federal job in the US that's where the line is. Whether you like the rule or not, you need to be able to live with it if you're going to accept the job.

And honestly, there are a couple of lookout TikTokers out there who clearly spend way more work time filming content than they do actually watching for smoke. It's hard not to see that as being a little problematic.

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u/Mysterious_Flight_ 14d ago

I dont think that they even care about monetization content, though. Like I said, there are people who post their federal jobs on tiktok with hundreds of thousands of followers without issue, some of them clearly have the knowledge/approval of their coworkers as they involve them in their videos. An EMT showing off their ambulance is no different from a lookout showing off their tower. If anything, the lookout is "more ethical" as the tower is both our workplace and our private residence

I completely agree that they shouldn't be sharing confidential information or neglecting the duties of their job to post online. I personally haven't seen that, but if it's happening it should be discouraged and punished. That's absolutely problematic, but thats a separate issue. Everyone agrees that it's unethical to post confidential information. Everyone agrees that you should prioritize your job over your hobbies and diligently watch for smokes.

The monetization though? I dont see a problem with that. Lookouts will work online jobs while working their tower. Some will make things that they will sell over the winter. Some will write books that they will sell. I dont see why a hobby like making/posting videos would be any different

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u/Such_Morning4459 14d ago

hey man, I'm really not trying to be mean or condescending, but do you know what a federal job is? because almost everything you just listed isn't a federal job. We're talking about usa federal jobs, not Becky making a tiktok at the ice-cream shop.

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u/Fluid_Supermarket711 14d ago

You’ve been condescending this whole thread, wild man.

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u/Mysterious_Flight_ 14d ago

I'm pretty sure every single job I listed can be a federal worker, even if not all of them are. Even if they're not, my point still stands. I doubt there are many federal jobs out there that dont have content of them online, including on tiktok, that are monetized. Like if you literally search "federal job USA" on tiktok there are hundreds of creators making videos about the fact that they have a federal job