What forward throw has the easiest fall?

[u/war_lobster]

I've seen discussion of the hardest falls (sode tsurikomi goshi and ura nage seem like popular choices for the worst fall), but what do you think is the easiest fall to take?

I ask about forward throws because they're all high-amplitude to some degree, but they don't all feel the same.

My own thoughts: I keep expecting uki goshi to be an easier fall, because it's a lower fulcrum than other hip throws--but actually that means the ground comes at me faster than I expected! The softest falls I can remember from a big throw have been harai goshi, but I could never tell if that was because of the throw or just the particularly smooth partner who liked to use it.

[u/okaa-pi]

According to my uke: morote seoi nage.

For me, I would say o goshi or a well executed Ippon seoi nage, depends on the Tori.

[u/rtsuya]

this is the progression for turn throws throws I use in my beginners class for break falls.

ogoshi -> koshi guruma -> uki goshi -> ippon seoi nage -> morote seoi nage

[u/Emperor_of_All]

I vote koshi guruma if you have a good tori, drop seio is nice and easy

[u/PaleoNinja420 → u/Emperor_of_All]

Agreed but with a bad Tori it can sometimes just drag your head and shoulders into the mat straight forward.

[u/milanrobin]

Our teacher usually used me as Uke for showing the other kids. It really depends on how Tori is performing.

Tai-otoshi, was always my personal favorite. Just 1 quick motion. I was always amazed by how quick this guy, would absolute send through the air. But the landing was always soft. It’s just perfect how you’re spun around and end up on your left side

But uki-goshi has the same idea with less speed so I guess I agree?? (still like tai-otoshi better)

[u/testdasi]

It is hard to say right? It depends on the throw but also the person making the throw.

If I have to vote, I would vote O Goshi.

[u/odie_za → u/testdasi]

Yeah definitely O Goshi

[u/SucksAtJudo]

Hiza guruma or sasae tsurikomi ashi, with the caveat that I realize I might get some arguments that I'm stretching the definition of "forward throw".

If consensus is that those don't count as forward throws, I would say morote Seio Nage, o goshi, and koshi guruma are all equally easy falls to take, even when executed less than perfectly or by an inexperienced tori.

[u/The_One_Who_Comments]

Maybe it's just the guy I train with, but O-Guruma is always the lightest to me.

It's the opposite of uki goshi in your thought experiment - a high pivot point.

Also Tori doesn't land on your, or project you towards the ground, nor can Tori under rotate you in a dangerous way. It's like a gentle version of tai otoshi

[u/Judotimo → u/The_One_Who_Comments]

I hate O Guruma. Only O Soto Gari tobthe back is worse.

[u/war_lobster → u/The_One_Who_Comments]

That's interesting about o-guruma because it's similar to my experience with (what I assumed was) harai goshi. I wonder if it's common to o guruma, ashi guruma, and harai.

[u/The_One_Who_Comments → u/war_lobster]

I think there's a version of "stick your leg out and make uke fall over it" that we're talking about, which is really low impact.

Nobody can distinguish between the three of them usually anyways.

[u/Various-Stretch2853]

Not sure if it counts, as its high amplitude but not thaaat forward. But i would say the one handed sukui-nage (sometimes called te-guruma). You can get uke really high before turning, but due to holding both leg and lapel can land uke like a feather (while having uke almost upsidedown inbetween if you feel like it⁾

[u/ReddJudicata]

It totally depends on tori. But generally a thrown where tori has a good two handed control all the way down (so uke doesn’t do something dumb)

I mean, I can smash the ever living hell out of someone with morote or set him down as light as a feather.

[u/fleischlaberl]

I would say all of those gliding and rolling movements where Uke's movement to his front is just extended

- Uki waza

- Uchi mata sukashi

- Yoko wakare

[u/Powerful-Gas-3702]

Drop Ippon seoi nage has my vote

[u/Sad_Calligrapher_697]

Nah uki goshi has a very quick whip action. you meet the ground quicker. A controlled Hane goshi from underhook and drop seoi/kataguruma from outside entry like the aikido guy after faking sasae are the most controlled and least damaging moves that I can personally attest to.

[u/amsterdamjudo]

There are many opinions, some I agree with, others I don’t. There is only one definitive, research based valid answer to the question: O Goshi.

When the Kodokan, the French Judo Federation and the IJF convened to work on the issue of making judo safer for children and adolescents, the research was lengthy and intense.

The work product was the Kodomo no Kata. This official Kodokan kata provides a core curriculum that is taught around the world.

I have used this in my dojo for the past two years with excellent results.

Back to the question at hand, many of the throws mentioned here are not found in the kata. Some are, but found later on when Uke has increased ukemi skills.

To reduce injuries and increase student retention, I recommend the Kodomo no Kata. 🥋

[u/chubblyubblums]

Obi tori gaeshi.  Tai otoshi if you're a good uke.

[u/milanrobin → u/chubblyubblums]

My man!! 🤝🤝 I LOVED tai-otoshi when I still did judo. That quick spin around before the soft landing. Perfection

[u/obi-wan-quixote]

Ken Ken Uchimata is by its nature nice and slow and easy to take. You just kind of fall over and tend not to get skyed.

[u/sprack]

I feel like maki-komi is easier to take than most because of how tight you're pressed against them when you hit the mat. There's no gap in time between when you hit the mat and they hit you.

[u/JudoRef]

Should be any forward throw where tori keeps both feet on the ground the whole time. Better balance for tori means better control over uke's fall.

[u/Go0o0n]

Sasae

[u/CaptainAlex2266]

IMO o goshi or seoi nage. Anything that lands directly on your back. Anything that can land you more on your side is a messier fall imo such as uchi mata.

[u/LoneWolf2662]

Tai otoshi and yoko gake are the worst to fall, best to fall prob are good ippon seoi nage, o goshi and if you count sutemi its tomoe nage

[u/Slickrock_1]

Imo sasae does, and maybe tai otoshi, you're not being lifted up at all. O goshi just depends, it's easy to let uke down easily but you can also slam the shit out of someone with it (and people just learning it who have no control throw really really hard). Seoi nage kills me when I'm thrown (ippon, not drop).

[u/SwimmingDepartment → u/Slickrock_1]

Sasae is a good observation. A lot of times the fall from this throw is less linear and doesn’t plant you on your back neatly.

I have to disagree with tai otoshi. Some of the guys at my gym love this throw and are capable of absolutely whipping uke into the mat with it. Short distance to fall, big impact. That’s my experience though.

[u/Slickrock_1 → u/SwimmingDepartment]

I guess comparing tai with harai, hani, uchi mata, etc the fulcrum that uke goes over is lower. But yeah I do see your point.

[u/SwimmingDepartment → u/Slickrock_1]

The cool thing about this thread is the variety of experience people are reporting. It’s so dependent on tori’s application that almost any perspective can be true.

[u/chubblyubblums → u/SwimmingDepartment]

That's on uke. Go forward into it.

[u/SwimmingDepartment → u/chubblyubblums]

Respectfully, I disagree. You don’t always get to go with it. In randori or shiai when someone legitimately catches you off guard with it, you’re going down hard. I’m a pretty good uke, and most people don’t give me issues with tai o. I’m just saying it can be a deceivingly hard throw.

[u/chubblyubblums → u/SwimmingDepartment]

Every single one of them can blow you up, especially if you're caught unawares. It's a contact sport. Some throws though are throwing you into the mat at a 90 degree angle. Tai otoshi can't really do that unless tori is willing to shred his own knee