Words and Names Ending in "en"

[u/iamcode101]

I will use Leeuwarden as an example. While on the train, the recorded announcements will say Leeuwarden so that the en sound at the end in clearly audible. The end sounds something like din from dinner.

However, when the staff make announcements, and when some people in general say Leeuwarden, the en sound gets buried and becomes more of an uh sound. So Leeuwar-din becomes Leeuwar-duh. I have noticed this often with other words and names, but not with all words ending in en and not with all Dutch speakers. If I say it like this, some people know what I am saying right away, while others do not.

Is this a regional thing? Am I imagining it? Or do people do this just to confuse me?

[u/WeabooBaby]

Yes you are right it's an accent thing. In and around the Randstad area (and the hollands in general) it's common that the last -n isn't really enunciated, making it sound more like Leeuwarde.

[u/BellatrixVanDetta → u/WeabooBaby]

Yes and in the east its more common to drop the e. Like lop'n or fiets'n. Although with (geographical) names its a bit more arbitrary.

[u/g88chum → u/BellatrixVanDetta]

For the northeast as well. For the entire part of the country with lower Saxon dialects.

[u/math1985 → u/WeabooBaby]

Fun thing is that the Leeuwarden-Den Haag trains are sometimes staffed by staff from Leeuwarden, and sometimes by staff from Den Haag. I always made a sport out of guessing from which end of the line the staff was...

[u/Viv3210]

Most Dutch dialects will drop the end-n. In West-Flemish, it’s the e that is dropped, so it becomes Leeuward’n

[u/AnOoB02 → u/Viv3210]

Jonaghold'n in d'n Aldi

[u/socialistpropaganda → u/AnOoB02]

Moeten wij dat rieken, dat er geen jonagolden zijn?!

[u/muffinsballhair]

You might want to read this: https://taalportaal.org/taalportaal/topic/pid/topic-14117140391691002

Basically, /n/-deletion in Dutch is a very complex thing to get a feel for when it sounds natural to do so and when it doesn't. The /n/ can always be pronounced to begin with so I'd start with just always pronouncing it even though it can sound a bit overtly stressed but the speech of non-native speakers will sound fairly robotic at the start to beginw with so that's really nothing to worry about.

[u/Firespark7]

It is a regiomal thing, mostly Randstad region: in words ending with /-ən/, the /n/ is not pronounced, unkess the next word starts with a vowel.

[u/Flilix]

This article shows maps of the Netherlands depicting how often the -n gets pronounced: https://www.dbnl.org/tekst/_taa007200101_01/_taa007200101_01_0020.php

There are many different maps in the article, depicting different situations. Overall, it's clear that the -n mostly gets pronounced in the North-East and in Zeeuws-Vlaanderen, and to a lesser extent also the rest of Zeeland and the North of Noord-Holland. The -n is dropped most often in Limburg and Brabant, and also quite often in Holland.

In Belgium, the more Western provinces (West-Vlaanderen, Oost-Vlaanderen) mostly preserve the -n while the more Eastern ones (Antwerpen, Vlaams-Brabant, Limburg) drop it. This matches the neighbouring regions in the South of the Netherlands.

[u/Captain_Jack_Falcon]

I think a formal train announcment might over-articulate every syllable, so it's completely clear (also to foreigners).

In other cases, it's probably accent/dialect as others have mentioned.

[u/NylaStasja]

Difference between official (recorded) and casually spoken language mostly. Like people make "you're" out of "you are"

[u/LeBertz → u/NylaStasja]

There is very little "official" about recorded language in the Netherlands. ABN has no hard rules, whereas the Belgians are way more formal about their "AN" (Algemeen Nederlands).

The Flemish would argue that emphasis on that last -n is wrong. I would also say it's hypercorrection (like pronouncing "het" instead of "ut"). Thing is: ABN is not formalized, so it is not correct to seperate official from casual Dutch.

[u/aczkasow → u/LeBertz]

Some Belgian dialects preserve it. Namely West-Flemish, they drop the «e» in «-en», so it becomes smth like «-'n». Like in modern German.

[u/Nothing-to_see_hr → u/LeBertz]

there is no such thing as ABN anymore...

[u/41942319 → u/Nothing-to_see_hr]

And the Belgians have the exact same rules as the Dutch since they're united in a single Taalunie, which is the organisation that sets the rules.

[u/BikePlumber → u/LeBertz]

When I was learning Dutch in Belgium, het could be said as HUT or as UT, but never the Netherlands HET.

The Dutch books say if the H is dropped then it's UT in the Netherlands, but with the H said, the E becomes an open E.

This doesn't exist in Belgium and the E in het always remains neutral schwa, with or without saying the H.

When I left Belgium almost 30 years ago, some young people were starting to reject Belgian Dutch though.

[u/Flobberplop]

This happens all the time. Listen to Dutch music, they even use the “uh” sound to rhyme things that would not rhyme otherwise:

“Ik zie twee mensuhh op het strand, ze lopen samuhhh hand in hand”

“Ik wil beginnuhhh, om van je te houwuhhh”

Etc.

[u/Foreign-Client-2970 → u/Flobberplop]

"Ik ga zwemmə in Bacardi lemə"

[u/Ambitious-Scheme964]

For all verbs, plurals, names etc you can drop the n of -en.

[u/MaartenTG]

My name is Maarten and everyone says Maartuh, same with every infinitive verb (ending with -en), most people say -uh in actual speach yes

[u/BikePlumber]

In Belgium the final N is often dropped and this may also be true in southern Netherlands or parts of the Netherlands.

I haven't been in the Netherlands much at all, but I spent 4 years in Belgium.

The final N is often or usually dropped in Belgium and for years I didn't know that was a Belgian thing only heard a few people say the final N.

[u/feindbild_]

If the -en is part of a grammatical ending (plural verbs and nouns) you need to drop the -n, except if the next word is a vowel. Not everyone does this but this is the most standard way of speaking, and is not 'informal' or anything like that. (Previously this was the only accepted way of pronouncing this.)

In names and other words where -en is just part of the entire word, like the name 'Leeuwarden', the same rule applies, but here it is somewhat more common to retain the -n than with the grammatical endings.) And similarly not dropped if the next word starts with a vowel.

[u/ekerkstra92 → u/feindbild_]

you need to drop the -n

I think "need to drop" is a bit too much, in parts of the Netherlands it happens, but certainly not everywhere.

[u/feindbild_ → u/ekerkstra92]

But like.. I said all of that?

Anyway yea speaking guides and teachers and the like used to insist on you doing this; and this is how most speakers speak--but for a while now it also accepted as 'standard' to not drop the -n.

[u/math1985 → u/feindbild_]

So, is the -en in Leeuwarden a grammatical ending? Did Leeuwarden start out as a single Leeuward, and did it only become Leeuwarden when more of them joined the party? Or is Leeuwarden something you can do, perhaps on a rainy Sunday afternoon?