r/politics • u/WhatYouThinkYouSee • Apr 16 '25
Paywall Van Hollen details meeting with vice president of El Salvador: “His answer was that the Trump administration is paying El Salvador, the government of El Salvador, to keep him at CECOT,”
https://nymag.com/intelligencer/article/kilmar-abrego-garcia-supreme-court-trump-administration-el-salvador-updates.html7.2k
u/Idkfriendsidk Apr 16 '25
Van Hollen said that he met with the vice president of El Salvador and asked why the government was holding Abrego Garcia if it lacks evidence that Abrego Garcia committed a crime. “His answer was that the Trump administration is paying El Salvador, the government of El Salvador, to keep him at CECOT,” he said.
When Van Hollen pressed him on why they can’t release Abrego Garcia today, he said the vice president echoed President Bukele’s Oval Office remarks about not being able to “smuggle” him back into the United States.
All those lies about how it was El Salvador preventing his release when the SOLE reason he is there is because the Trump administration is paying to keep him there.
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u/Indubitalist Apr 16 '25 edited Apr 16 '25
It’s a step toward returning Garcia. It’s important. Having this clarity means the American judiciary is better informed on what it needs to demand of the administration. This administration needs to pay to return Garcia to American custody, or at least assure El Salvador that they may keep the payment to incarcerate him despite them relinquishing him to American custody. Today.
Edit: And Van Hollen should be commended for his courage in going into the lion’s den to get this clarity. Hopefully acts like this embolden others to act.
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u/Antique_Scheme3548 Apr 16 '25
And Kudos to the Vice-President of El Salvador for speaking the Truth, a rare commodity.
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u/gringledoom Apr 16 '25
I'm hoping this blows up in their faces in court, and Trump goes on an angry posting spree targeting that guy, lol.
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u/ArticulateRhinoceros Apr 16 '25 edited Apr 16 '25
Me too. Senator Van Hollen is going to bat as hard as he can for the rights of a
legalresident, married to an American and father to an American child, and Trump is fighting tooth and nail to condemn him. I dare Trump to complain about how Hollen is getting in the way of his ability to disappear Americans. The optics are pretty damning for Trump.Edited to correct mistake about legal status
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u/gringledoom Apr 16 '25
And at every step, someone accidentally makes an admission that undercuts them in court.
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u/claimTheVictory Apr 16 '25
Did you see JD Vance's tweet today?
Essentially arguing against "due process" completely.
Scary times.
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u/TranquilSeaOtter Apr 16 '25
Seems like he spent a couple of tweets basically arguing the courts are getting in the way of mass deportations so fuck due process, they wanna do what they want. Fucking insane. I guess JD Vance called Trump America's Hitler endearingly.
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u/Syzygy2323 California Apr 16 '25
If Trump is America's Hitler, Vance is America's Goering.
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u/Desert-Noir Apr 16 '25
Maybe JD should lead by example and send his Indian wife the fuck back to India, I mean does this guy have principles or not?
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u/thealtcowninja Apr 17 '25
Ignoring the courts is part of Yarvin's plan with this autarchy they're trying to establish.
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u/HawaiianPunchaNazi Apr 17 '25
when speak of Curtis Yarvin,it's always a good idea to link what you're talking about because the average person is just learning about him.
I've got you :-)
this was making the rounds of Reddit when it first came out, but it's always good to get out to more people:
https://youtu.be/5RpPTRcz1no?si=5kW7EUc83UGAtaI3
this is your explainer video for TLDR set.
for the people who can't handle harsh truth without entertainment value,here is the BEYOND THE BASTARDS HISTORY PODCAST, explaining exactly who this man is and why you should be scared:
https://youtu.be/mYrPNvVhKLU?si=5fprFbTxqvr06TpZ
why yes, there's a subreddit for that (always is;-)
but before you go there, run a search over all the subreddits--you want credible people you already know talking, and these are mainstream subreddits saying these things.
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u/zzxxccbbvn I voted Apr 16 '25
What did the tweet say? I can't seem to find it?
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u/claimTheVictory Apr 16 '25 edited Apr 16 '25
From 21 hours ago
"Consider that Joe Biden allowed approximately 20 million illegal aliens into our country. This placed extraordinary burdens on our country--our schools, hospitals, housing, and other essential services were overwhelmed. On top of that, many of these illegal aliens committed violent crimes, or facilitated fentanyl and sex trafficking. That is the situation we inherited.
The American people elected the Trump administration to solve this problem. The President has successfully stopped the inflow of illegal aliens, and now we must deport the people who came here illegally.
To say the administration must observe "due process" is to beg the question: what process is due is a function of our resources, the public interest, the status of the accused, the proposed punishment, and so many other factors. To put it in concrete terms, imposing the death penalty on an American citizen requires more legal process than deporting an illegal alien to their country of origin.
When the media and the far left obsess over an MS-13 gang member and demand that he be returned to the United States for a third deportation hearing, what they're really saying is they want the vast majority of illegal aliens to stay here permanently.
Here's a useful test: ask the people weeping over the lack of due process what precisely they propose for dealing with Biden's millions and millions of illegals. And with reasonable resource and administrative judge constraints, does their solution allow us to deport at least a few million people per year?
If the answer is no, they've given their game away. They don't want border security. They don't want us to deport the people who've come into our country illegally. They want to accomplish through fake legal process what they failed to accomplish politically:
The ratification of Biden's illegal migrant invasion.
President Trump and I will not stand fori t."
Reminder that if anyone can be renditioned without due process, then everyone can be.
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u/self-assembled Apr 16 '25
People are correcting you, but as I read, he had a court order saying he CAN'T be deported to El Salvador for safety reasons. So he's not exactly legal, but definitely in a kind of gray area as opposed to just illegal.
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u/BaldingBush Apr 16 '25
The courts made a ruling. He is allowed to stay. That makes it legal, regardless of resident status. The illegal part is based solely on entering the country without authorization.
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u/rokerroker45 Apr 16 '25
in the spirit of accurate information, technically speaking he was not allowed to stay, he was just protected from deportation to el salvador. That means his removal to el salvador is especially heinous because it explicitly violates the court order, but unfortunately he was not authorized to stay in the US except to the extent the US was choosing not to deport him anywhere other than el salvador (which in a sane world means he stays in the US, because no country normally takes non-nationals as deportees)
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u/sir_racho Apr 16 '25
whereas the deportation was in fact just illegal. criminal contempt proceedings against exec. underway
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u/Atreyu1002 Apr 16 '25
Trump has made a million damning moves all the way to the presidency a second time. We aren't going to prosecute him out of office or even litigate him out of office. He'll probably die in office, and we need to fix the broken system, and fix the broken democrats.
There's no fixing the GOP, they need to burn in hell along with Trump.
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u/Nena902 Apr 16 '25
The democrats must start thinking like the republicans. What would the republicans do if they were the minority and Biden or Obama was breaking the constitution, behaving like a dictator or a king and sidelining SCOTUS.
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u/Atreyu1002 Apr 16 '25
Democratic voters penalize their candidates when they misbehave, GOP doesn't. The two parties aren't the same.
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u/EllieVader Apr 17 '25
I won't penalize any of my reps for stepping up right now. The fact that they aren't is actively eroding my support and respect and makes me far more likely to vote for someone else next time.
Hell, the fact that my governor is on Krasnov's idiot shit list makes me exceptionally proud of her.
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u/Nena902 Apr 16 '25
I understand that, but democrat voters are getting sick and tired of the democrat leaders doing nothing while our country is being torn apart and our constitution is being burned to ashes so what else is left. It's time for democrat leaders to break protocol and start taking action. Democrat voters I assure you will be fine with it if they can successfully remove Trump fom office. Break the rules because there are no rules anymore.
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u/EllieVader Apr 17 '25
Want to get more people to vote in the next election? Fucking do something that makes it worthwhile for people to get out and vote.
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u/failed_novelty Apr 16 '25
Just to make sure the facts are clear:
- The dude was not here legally, he isn't a 'legal resident'
- He did have a protective order that made it illegal to send him 'back' to El Salvadore
- Other than the lack of legal status, he committed no crime in the US or El Salvadore
- He absolutely should never have been sent there, and there is no reason to not bring him back that doesn't boil down to evil, stupid, petty, or plain incompetent reasons.
To be clear, you are only incorrect about him being a legal resident. That changes nothing of the rest of your statement.
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u/mushroomroomroomroom Apr 16 '25
He doesn't have "legal permanent resident" status but he was in the US legally. He had "withholding of removal" status, which is a legal status that allows him to legally live and work in the US indefinitely.
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u/failed_novelty Apr 17 '25
That makes sense. He entered illegally, but was not remaining here illegally.
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u/Patient_End_8432 Apr 16 '25
While I appreciate you clarifying things, I also have to state one more thing.
NONE of the people sent to CECOT truly deserve it. I can kinda get behind violent gang members being sent to a horrendous jail, but this whole fuck up just shows how that would immediately turn into disappearing people.
And even then, we should not condone sending people to a jail that brags that no one has ever left alive. Especially considering at least 75% of the people sent have never committed a violent crime.
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u/failed_novelty Apr 17 '25
NONE of the people sent to CECOT truly deserve it.
Absolutely not. None of them at all. I want them all returned. Sure, some might end up legally and after a fair trial deported back to their original countries, but none should be in a modern-day concentration camp.
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u/Kopitar4president Apr 16 '25
Court Order: You are to facilitate his return.
Trump admin: You mean literally impede his return, right?
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u/Mr_Horsejr Apr 16 '25
Is this a one time fee? Is it monthly? Annually? Is this a good use of American tax dollars?? Terrorizing good people who can’t even afford the medical help he’ll need should, I hope to God he’s alive, he come back and in need of intense therapy to deal with the PTSD that is just now becoming acceptable and seen as a real health condition only thanks to the Veterans whose medical health privacy is apparently breached on a daily basis?
I know this seems meandering, and maybe it is, because this is fucking chilling, but how the fuck do you look your voters in the face and say “yeah, we’re paying people in other countries to imprison people without due process which is in direct conflict with the constitution with which we’re sworn to protect? Money that could have been spent to otherwise improve a service of which those who sacrificed most has the most need of?
It’s our money! They’re doing this with the fucking money that you receive every week/bi-weekly/monthly basis. I’m sick.
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u/sir_racho Apr 16 '25
the regime already lost in court. massively. 9-0 SC against. criminal contempt proceedings underway. they're laughing about it. "where is your army" shit addressed at the judiciary.
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u/SheHerDeepState Michigan Apr 16 '25
He's covering his own ass. Bukele wants to kiss up to Trump but little El Salvador has to be prepared for Trump to abandon them.
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u/intrepidcaribou Apr 16 '25
Trump doesn't have friends or allies. He only has stooges. Once El Salvador is no longer convenient, he'll dump them. An El Salvador doesn't have a lot of friends.
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u/gopeepants Apr 16 '25
Everything with Diaper Don is transactional. He sees people as assets.
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u/okimlom Apr 16 '25
Bukele is soon going to find himself as the new Zelensky in the Trump world, where Trump will attempt to blackmail and do other illegal tactics for Trump's benefit without one to El Salvador.
Trump doesn't have new tricks. He does the same thing over and over again.
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u/Polantaris Apr 16 '25
Never forget: Trump is a mob boss. Mob bosses only have one strategy: Extortion, followed by "accidents".
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u/Thowitawaydave Apr 16 '25
Seriously, speaking truth to power is never easy in the best of times, and we are definitely not in those.
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u/mces97 Apr 16 '25
I mean, very little kudos. What he essentially said is we will imprison innocent people in a concentration camp for money. That's like if Hitler said he's being paid by some other country to keep Jews in camps. We shouldn't praise the guys honesty. He just admitted human trafficking is legal, for a price.
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u/Harpua81 Apr 16 '25
And he'll never be heard or seen again. RIP VP of El Salvador
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u/notreallyswiss Apr 16 '25
I mean the President of El Salvador said the same thing when he was in the US, right down to the remark about not being able to "smuggle" Garcia back to the US and that the US is currently paying $6 million to El Salvador for holding these people at CECOT. So this is the official party line.
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u/Vihurah Apr 16 '25
probably only because the truth is of no consequence. they probably expect nothing to come of it one way or another
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u/code_archeologist Georgia Apr 16 '25 edited Apr 16 '25
This is also a huge campaign opportunity for Democrats. If the Trump administration is paying for prisoners to be held then Democrats should campaign on sitting down this illegal program that is funneling money to foreign governments to imprison people without due process. Frame it as:
The Trump Administration is sending money to dictators to hold people they don't like in concentration camps where hundreds have been tortured and killed. We will put an end to that.
And when they say:
These people are dangerous criminals part of Venezuelan gangs invading or country.
The Democrats counter with:
How do you even know that if not a single one of them have had their day in court? How do you even know that you haven't sent legal residents and citizens? By the list of names we do have 90% of the people you sent have no criminal record.
And when they say:
Some errors may have been made but the administration is looking into it.
Counter with:
Some errors? By ignoring the 5th amendment, which the administration has been held in contempt for and you have done nothing to hold them accountable for... Any person hearing this could be shipped off "in error" to be tortured in this concentration camp.
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u/notreallyswiss Apr 16 '25
These things have been said by numerous people, Democrats included. The people who voted for Trump don't care. The general mindset among them seems to be that if bad things happen to people it's because God doesn't love those people, and trying to get the back or help them in any way is going against God's will. That's the reason so many of them call Democrats devils or minions of Satan because they believe that helping those in trouble is aiding and abetting Satan.
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u/code_archeologist Georgia Apr 16 '25
The MAGAts are lost to the country. There is no point in trying to convince them, we can only mitigate the damage they cause.
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u/waldorflover69 Apr 16 '25
We are never going to convinced the MAGA people to change sides but we may be able to convince the people that didn’t vote this time that’s in their best interest to next time.
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u/Darth_Malgus_1701 Oregon Apr 16 '25
I really hope he's still alive.
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u/Phrogme1 Apr 16 '25
THIS. Trump is such a LIAR, if his DOJ is claiming Abrego Garcia is “alive & secure”. I have a tendency NOT to believe them.
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u/Ratorasniki Apr 16 '25
I do too, but I'm really unable to conceive of any world where this man is allowed to be in a position to come home and go in front of a TV camera to tell his story. Second hand it is a national shame. Firsthand it could be a powderkeg. I'm worried about what happens to this guy as the court asserts itself and presses the issue.
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u/GuerreroUltimo Apr 17 '25
This is what really angers me. Calling the question about returning him "preposterous" is a bad sign. What makes it preposterous? Just turn him over to our government and they can bring him back. Not a challenge or illegal. Unless he is dead. These liars cannot be believed.
I had a friend get raging about abortion again when I saw him yesterday. First I said "Yeah, we also need to make sure we have child healthcare in place for these kids as the mother does not want them, is too young, or cannot care for them. He starts whining about how they parent can take care of them or not. So, only cares until birth. Forcing a woman to have a child. Pro-life he said.
Then I asked the dumb fuck about Garcia. And others illegally deported. Nah, who cares. Not our job to "take in the worlds trash" and "I do not care what happens or happened to this person". I mean, pro life right?
Not sure where he came up with this at but he said that the bulls hat was MS-13. And that this was a sign. That he was not working and living off his wife and the system or some shit. I had read before he had a job with a union who was assisting in getting him back.
The spinning of the lies by these people and their braindead, not brainwashed I am finding out, sheep will buy anything. Just change the narrative. I have basically stopped talking to most people now because there are just too many of them. I know some that voted Trump that are regretting it. But that does not hide the good 50 million that are really terrible people.
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u/Darth_Malgus_1701 Oregon Apr 17 '25
I know some that voted Trump that are regretting it
They only regret it because Trump's idiocy is hurting them. They don't care one iota about other people.
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u/GimpyGeek Apr 16 '25
I also think it's a good question to ask: Where is the money Trump is paying them from coming from? Did El Salvador get any of this money yet or just an empty promise like Trump likes to make? Trump does NOT control the purse strings, congress does, if he's giving them money from somewhere it was probably not appropriated for it.
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u/keskeskes1066 Apr 16 '25
Remember the congressman killed when he went to check on his constituents in Jonestown?
This was a brave act.
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u/FartyJizzums Apr 16 '25 edited Apr 16 '25
It's almost as if the Trump administration is solely comprised of soulless, tyrannical, totalitarian, fascists that value money and power over living humans.
Oh, wait...
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u/Disastrous_Hell_4547 Apr 16 '25
They all wear gold crosses, though? And they even set up a prayer room in the White House.
Oh, wait…
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u/FartyJizzums Apr 16 '25
It's almost as if the political right uses religion as a weapon to persecute their foes and a tool to convince the low educated that authoritarianism is justifiable.
Oh, wait...
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u/ahdidi413 Apr 16 '25
“Van Hollen said he asked the El Salvadoran vice president if he could meet with Abrego Garcia, but that the leader said he needed to “make earlier provisions” to visit the prison. The senator then emphasized that he wasn’t looking to tour CECOT, but that he simply wanted to see Abrego Garcia.
“He said he was not able to make that happen,” Van Hollen told reporters.”
Only one possible way to interpret this in my opinion. This is awful.
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u/FlyingMonkeySoup Apr 16 '25
Unfortunately Barrio 18 had been extorting Abrego's family and threatened to kill his older brother (who is now an American citizen) and then him. Which is why he fled El Salvador in the first place. As soon it was publicly known that he was in CECOT I'm sure the gang had him killed, at least that was his and his families concern. It was also the reason that an immigration judge placed him in withholding status....
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u/egosomnio Pennsylvania Apr 16 '25
Inmates there apparently have practically no contact with the outside world, so unless someone in the gang knew about him before they went in (and still cares about their gang business at this point), that might not be the case. They also spend almost all of their time in their cells, so he'd have to be put in one with them for it to happen.
Not saying something couldn't happen. Just that the awful conditions in the place seem like they'd work against that sort of bringing outside grudges in.
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u/DickButkisses Apr 16 '25
It’s not just your opinion, it’s the logical conclusion of facts. There are only a few left open to interpretation, and they’re being slowly clarified. He’s gone.
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u/TheEgonaut Apr 16 '25
Or they just don’t want him to be able to talk about the horrors he endured. Either way, fuck Trump.
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u/Training-Accident-36 Apr 16 '25
The conversation continued and in the end the VP said that maybe the United States Embassy to El Salvador could make a phone call happen.
(after making a million excuses why Van Hollen couldn't make a call right now)
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u/Much_Guava_1396 Apr 16 '25
It’s important to underscore the “make earlier provisions” part. No one has been able to see the ”raw” inner workings of the prison. It’s all been carefully guided tours. Pretty much a show for the cameras.
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u/notreallyswiss Apr 16 '25
And those carefully guided tours have shown things horrible enough to make you sick. Don't want to imagine the "raw" part.
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u/kirukiru Oregon Apr 16 '25
They can't arrange a meeting with or release him anyways because CECOT is a death camp and he is already dead.
People need to understand this. Stephen Miller and the fascists within the Trump administration are fast tracking unaccountable, foreign death camps and are trying to do it while they still have goodwill with the public in the hopes that it will be forgotten.
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u/zephyrtr New York Apr 16 '25
A big reason the Holocaust was able to go on for as long as it did were twofold: a general global antisemitism and no journalists or diplomats gaining access to the death camps. Keeping Garcia and CECOT in the news is going to continue to erode Trump's support in Congress until they start losing support, then seats and finally power. It's also why they will fully refuse to repatriate Garcia where he would be free to tell his story to the press.
Congressional Republicans are ALLOWING Trump to do this. Never forget that.
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u/kirukiru Oregon Apr 16 '25
It's also why they will fully refuse to repatriate Garcia where he would be free to tell his story to the press.
Its why Van Hollen is being flatly denied access to the facility even though Republicans can do photo ops there whenever they want. He's gone and the only thing left to do is to get actual eyes on CECOT and whats going on there at this point.
None of the people sent there are ever coming back.
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u/NefariousnessFun1547 Apr 16 '25
The crazy thing is -- the Trumpers don't care if it is. If they had footage that looked like Auschwitz coming out of there, if they were burning people in crematoriums ... Trump's supporters still would support him.
I'm a high school history teacher, and I like to say that history doesn't repeat, but it always rhymes. And what we're seeing in the US rhymes with pasty and bolocaust.
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u/intrepidcaribou Apr 16 '25
That Kristi Noem feature they had with her in the prison was the most concentration camp coded shit I've seen this century. They aren't even hiding it; they don't care.
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u/sachiprecious North Carolina Apr 16 '25
If he's dead, his family deserves an investigation into his cause of death, and they also deserve to have his body sent to them so he can have a proper funeral. But I know El Salvador would love to just bury him in a mass grave like they've done to so many other prisoners, without notifying their families.
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u/IndecorousRex Apr 16 '25
This is what pisses me off. It’s not Trump that’s paying him, it’s the American tax dollars. I don’t want my money to be used for human rights violations!
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u/Ras_Alghoul Apr 16 '25
All this talk about saving money. They are wasting money deporting and keeping people at facilities.
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u/subLimb Apr 16 '25
Whether it's deportations, mass government firings, or tariffs, the theme of this administration is pretty consistent: They are looting the wealth of America in order to hurt people.
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u/Ferelar New Jersey Apr 17 '25
They are also spending significantly more than Biden during the same period of the respective presidencies, despite Biden entering the Oval in the middle of a worldwide pandemic and colossal economic fallout.
Turns out that firing massive amounts of workers doesn't work for saving money. Salaries are around 4% of the Federal budget, and guess what people do for their salaries? They work! Some of them were doing things like negotiating less expensive deals for government purchases, or collecting funds for the government to use in other matters. When you fire them, negotiations stop; collections stop; ALL of the things they do in the day to day stop. It's wildly inefficient, and even if they fired every Federal employee, they'd "save" 4% of the budget and end up ballooning the other 96% tenfold trying to keep up.
It was NEVER about saving money- it was always about destroying the Federal government so that rich people had no opposition or checks on their power.
People need to start paying attention and recognize that we are already at war with the oligarchs and have been for a long time. They're firing volleys into our lines and a huge chunk of the populace either doesn't care, doesn't know, or is cheering it on.
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u/SlothFoc Apr 16 '25
I don’t want my money to be used for human rights violations!
I got a lot of bad news for ya.
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u/CouchCorrespondent Apr 16 '25
Basically the message today is that he can send someone to another country....especially one with a dictator.......and get away with throwing away constitutional rights.
Is this where we are? Is this WHO we are?
It's not going to stop if he gets away with doing it. This is just the beginning.
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u/squeamishfun Apr 16 '25
Trump made the moves to get Andrew Tate back and has no power to get back Garcia. Yeeaaaahhhh. Okay. Guess what his priorities are.
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u/Hadrian23 Apr 16 '25
And Tate fucked right back off to Romania the nanosecond lawyers started eyeing.
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u/BlueTreeThree Apr 16 '25
Is the administration even saying they can’t get him back? All I see is them saying they won’t get him back.
It’s like people are reflexively inventing a semi-plausible explanation for what’s happening that isn’t just that Trump and his gang are cruel fascist monsters.
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u/squeamishfun Apr 16 '25
They are saying Bukele won’t release him. Like it’s out of their hands. But we all know Bukele is bought and paid for. I also read from senator Van Hollen that just went down to get Garcia back- Bukele is being paid to keep Garcia and he intends to do just that. He refused to allow the Senator to see him. The only way in is with that dictators permission.
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u/RiffRaffCatillacCat Apr 16 '25
Yes. This is who Republican voters are. They want deathcamps for the people they dislike.
Crazy thing is, there is nothing hyperbolic about the above statement. We are literally watching it in real time.
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u/pawiwowie Apr 17 '25
I always wondered what a modern day Holocaust would look like. I think the Chinese got there first with what they did with the Uighurs, now America is outsourcing the nasty work to the Salvadoreans and building new concentration camps in Guantanamo. Is it already too late to stop it?
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u/Allydarvel Apr 17 '25
People just aint getting this. They think Trump is scared to bring the guy back. He is not. He doesn't care. Guy rots in prison till he dies..and trump fans say job well done. Guy comes back does TV, press conferences, whatever, people protest, maybe to the extent of George Floyd protests..Trump calls in national guard, army, and crush the protests and trump fans love him even more. I can guarantee the Trump supproters don't give a shit he is innocent..they are saying do more..stupid judges, get out the way.
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u/Meet_James_Ensor Apr 16 '25
It clearly is who we are. People in the regular non-Reddit world barely seem to know or care that this stuff is even happening.
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u/Dest123 Apr 16 '25
I don't think it's true that they don't know or care. I've spoken to multiple conservatives that I know in real life and they all actively support this. They also all actively support sending US citizens to El Salvador as well, but most of them were a bit disappointed and didn't think that would actually happen.
People need to start realizing: it's not that they don't know or care, they 100% support this.
If you don't believe me, go ask any of your Trump supporter friends and family what they think about this stuff. I have yet to find any that are against it.
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u/AlphaGoldblum Apr 16 '25
The right has fully let the most hateful part of their contingency take over.
That's what it comes down to. And now we all suffer as a result of it.
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u/lizmatiq Apr 16 '25
Forgive me as I don’t have conservatives in my life to ask, but do you know how they would feel if it comes out that he’s been killed? Would they support the USA shipping people off to be killed?
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u/Dest123 Apr 16 '25
I do actually know the answer to that because one of them, completely unprompted, justified their position for El Salvador by saying that they were for more capital punishment. They would actually rather see them killed than sent to El Salvador. El Salvador was just a good alternative to capital punishment for them.
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u/rabbit994 Virginia Apr 16 '25
I know some, they don't care. In this case, they just hear "Not legally present", he was deported to his home country and are like "And?"
They see lawyers arguing about it as just more proof that immigration system is broken and many of them are over it.
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u/gigglefarting North Carolina Apr 16 '25
Almost. The message is that he’ll use tax payer money to pay the governments of other countries to do this.
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u/drfsrich Apr 16 '25
It's who the right wing is. They voted for it and Congressional Republicans are letting it happen.
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u/greatWrightshark Apr 16 '25
Huge credit to Van Hollen for going down there.
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u/Ted_E_Bear Apr 16 '25
Big time. What he has learned and what he might still learn while he's down there is a huge deal of epic proportions. Our government paying other governments to go against Supreme Court orders is a crisis beyond anything we've seen since I don't even know when.
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u/EmpiricalMystic Apr 16 '25
I don't know that anything like this has happened before in this country. Not at this scale and severity, at least.
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u/The_Seeker_25920 Apr 16 '25
Ummm the trail of tears?
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u/EmpiricalMystic Apr 16 '25
Relevant comparison for sure, but we weren't paying another country to do it. Not that it makes it any less awful, of course.
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u/Yes-I-Cannabis Washington Apr 16 '25
As shitty as it is, indigenous people didn’t have protected legal status with the US government yet when the Trail of Tears happened because neither the 14th amendment nor the Indian Citizenship Act had been written yet.
Abrego Garcia specifically availed himself of the laws of the US and received immigration protection.
Both are reprehensible, but not exactly comparing apples to apples.
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u/HolycommentMattman Apr 16 '25
Yeah. Trail of Tears was terrible for sure, but bear in mind that we still had slaves at the time. The Emancipation Proclamation wouldn't be penned for another 20-30 years (depending on what date you want to say ToT started). This is pre-civil war America.
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u/elmekia_lance Apr 16 '25
this is basically the Bush administration policy of extraordinary rendition to CIA black sites, but being applied to US legal residents and soon US citizens.
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u/Norm_Hastings Apr 16 '25
Japanese internment camps, for one. Really no shortage of atrocities committed by the US, within it, or without.
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u/GoodUserNameToday Apr 16 '25
One of his constituents was abducted and sent to a concentration camp. He should be pissed.
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u/Brock_Hard_Canuck Canada Apr 16 '25
Hopefully Van Hollen has a good security detail for this trip too.
Don't want another Leo Ryan / Jonestown situation happening.
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u/sachiprecious North Carolina Apr 16 '25
There are some important updates in this article:
2:22pm EDT
Senator says he doesn’t know if Abrego Garcia is alive and well
A reporter asked Van Hollen if he was concerned about whether Abrego Garcia was still alive.
“I don’t know about his health status. That’s exactly why I wanted to meet with him directly. That’s why I wanted to talk to him on the phone. That’s why I want to arrange a phone call with his wife. I mean, this is a notorious prison,” he said.
2:14pm EDT
Van Hollen: Government wouldn’t arrange visit with Abrego Garcia
Van Hollen said he asked the El Salvadoran vice president if he could meet with Abrego Garcia, but that the leader said he needed to “make earlier provisions” to visit the prison. The senator then emphasized that he wasn’t looking to tour CECOT, but that he simply wanted to see Abrego Garcia.
“He said he was not able to make that happen,” Van Hollen told reporters.
The senator said the vice president said he couldn’t promise a visit if Van Hollen returned next week or even a phone or video call between Abrego Garcia and his family.
“He said he could not arrange that. He said, ‘maybe if the American embassy were to ask. Maybe that could happen,” Van Hollen said. “So, I will certainly ask the American embassy to ask the government of El Salvador to connect us by phone.”
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u/goldbman North Carolina Apr 16 '25
Jesus, they couldn't even get him on the phone. Not a good sign.
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u/JustAnotherLich Apr 16 '25
Prisoners at CECOT are not permitted any contact with the outside world, regardless of status or otherwise who they are. No phone calls, no visits, no letters, absolutely nothing. It is literally a concentration camp. If they don't allow regular prisoners phone calls, they certainly won't allow one who that might have an amplified voice to the media.
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u/Rapzid Texas Apr 16 '25
They would allow it for their masters but good luck getting anyone from the Executive to ask.
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u/markevens Apr 16 '25
Abrego Garcia is 100% dead
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u/TheSleepingVoid Hawaii Apr 16 '25
I'm going to the protest on Saturday and my sign is going to say "Justice for Abrego Garcia"
I know protesting won't be a magical fix, but I can't just do nothing.
I feel sick reading the news about this.
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u/BarbaGramm Apr 16 '25
Another way to say "democracy is dead" is "he's probably guilty anyway."
Homegrowns are next.
Homegrowns are next.
Homegrowns are next.
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u/Phrogme1 Apr 16 '25
THIS. Torches & Pitchforks Time!!! Torches & Pitchforks. No government can withstand an aroused public opinion. United We Stand. In the words of a famous Mexican “I’d rather die on my feet than live on my knees!”
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u/firenamedgabe Apr 16 '25
This is America we have the second amendment for a reason that’s outlined in the constitution, no need for torches and pitchforks
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Apr 16 '25
Damn, shouldn’t have filed my taxes yesterday
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u/Podwitchers Apr 16 '25
I didn’t. Couldn’t stomach it. Extension and then we’ll see…
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u/gatsby712 Apr 16 '25
I’m going to borrow money from El Salvador to pay my tax liability and then just not pay back the loan.
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u/Duane_ Apr 16 '25
"how much to get him out?"
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u/menagerath Apr 16 '25
Seriously, you could crowdfund a bribe to get him out and it would still be less than what Elon pays for an election.
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u/Zelcron Apr 16 '25
He's dead. They wouldn't let Van Hollen confirm he is alive.
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u/BlueTreeThree Apr 16 '25
They don’t let anyone out of the prison and they don’t let anyone in to see the prisoners except for approved propaganda reasons.. that could also be the reason.
It’s super disrespectful how so many people are just like “he’s dead. So sad. What a tragedy.” This man could be fighting for his life at this very moment, and his family is fighting to get him back. Don’t start thinking despair is a virtue..
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u/ERedfieldh Apr 17 '25
he’s dead. So sad. What a tragedy.
Uh no. We're not like "so sad what a tragedy" we're "the fucking fuck how the fuck we letting this fucking bullshit happen!?"
Don't make our comments sound passive like that.
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u/LangyMD Apr 16 '25
I'm honestly a bit surprised that they answered that honestly.
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Apr 16 '25
not like there are any consequences
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u/LangyMD Apr 16 '25
The consequence is possibly El Salvadore no longer getting that money, such as due to court orders not to send money/detainees to El Salvadore.
It's possible Trump will ignore those orders, but at that point he's flirting with civil war even harder than he already is.
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u/ahdidi413 Apr 16 '25
The fact that they’re willing to admit this so openly is a frightening sign of how comfortable both sides are with this level of corruption.
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u/Imacatdoincatstuff Apr 16 '25
Neither government wants him talking to American media.
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u/Any-Self2072 Apr 16 '25
Every single person in America needs to watch "The worlds highest security prison: CECOT by Ruhi Cenet on YT and ask themselves if they want to be put there for criticizing the government - because that's exactly what they want to/are going to try/may succeed at doing.
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u/Usawasfun Apr 16 '25
I'd start carrying a cyanide pill. Death is better than that place.
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u/Any-Self2072 Apr 16 '25
Do not go gentle into that good night. You are MANY and they are few <3 humanity will prevail.
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u/gatsby712 Apr 16 '25
Carry a gun instead and if anyone attempts to kidnap you remember the moment before you get kidnapped and panic is the best chance you have at survival. Once you are in someone else’s custody those odds go down significantly.
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Apr 16 '25
Is anyone surprised that this horribly corrupt admin, with a CONVICTED RAPIST at the helm, has paid their way to execute this nonsense???
Fuck you Donald
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u/adle1984 Texas Apr 16 '25
This is a cover up and a conspiracy by the Trump administration. They all need to be held accountable. I am hoping beyond hope that the Maryland man is alive.
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u/Jeembo California Apr 16 '25
Just so I'm clear on what's happening here.. we are:
Arresting people off the street who have no warrants or criminal history
Not charging them with any crime and not giving them any recourse to present their case
Shipping them to a random country which they may have never stepped foot in
Putting them into a prison known for its brutality and terrible conditions with no apparent release date; a prison where they're proud that no one ever leaves alive
This is what's happening? And there are people cheering this? In America? In 2025?
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u/Meister_Retsiem Apr 16 '25
Racists love it. They fantasize about stuff like this and now they see it happening
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u/True_Let_2007 Apr 16 '25
Message to fellow americans: Guys, I have some news for you: please realize that you have fallen deep into a dictatorship!
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Apr 16 '25
Yikes. It really looks like the USA is a fascist dictatorship, and it only took a few months.
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u/CobraPony67 Washington Apr 16 '25
The Republicans in congress are complicit in this by allowing T to allocate spending without their approval. They can hold back funds if they want to, but they remain silent. Guess they are on vacation, no big deal a person is rotting in a jail without their due process and not have committed any crime. He followed the rules but they don't matter for this administration.
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u/Schiffy94 New York Apr 16 '25
I'm sorry what? The Vice President of El Salvador just said that the Trump administration is paying them to keep a wrongfully deported man imprisoned? That's... a crime, right? Are there receipts? Ask for receipts, Chris.
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u/Diligent-Wave-4150 Apr 16 '25
The senator said the vice president said he couldn’t promise a visit if Van Hollen returned next week or even a phone or video call between Abrego Garcia and his family.
“He said he could not arrange that. He said, ‘maybe if the American embassy were to ask. Maybe that could happen,” Van Hollen said. “So, I will certainly ask the American embassy to ask the government of El Salvador to connect us by phone.”
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u/abial2000 Apr 16 '25
The simplest reading of this is that he’s dead. But there’s another (also horrifying) option: he’s been physically abused to such degree that he needs more than a week to recover.
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u/Smrleda Apr 16 '25
I do not believe Americans voted to imprison our prisoners in another country. Maybe Trump supporters did.
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u/Otherotherothertyra Apr 16 '25
Maybe Americans should I don’t know trusted the guy that campaigned on locking people up in another country then. Americans don’t get to feign surprise now cause me and millions of people have been pleading with ya’ll for ten years to stop this before it reached this point, Americans had a decade of warnings that this was going to happen.
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u/The_LSD_Soundsystem Apr 16 '25
So our taxpayer money is going to a Latin American dictatorship in order to deport people illegally and without due process?
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u/DancingWithAWhiteHat America Apr 16 '25
We need to see the contract between El Salvador and our government
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u/pifumd Apr 16 '25
The senator then emphasized that he wasn’t looking to tour CECOT, but that he simply wanted to see Abrego Garcia.
“He said he was not able to make that happen,” Van Hollen told reporters.
This dude is not still alive
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u/Dependent-Prompt6491 Apr 16 '25
President Van Hollen. This guy is the real deal. Watching that YouTube presser from San Salvador gave me hope for the first time in weeks. This guy is lightyears more intelligent and sophisticated that most of the current admin insecure keystone cops and vain media taking heads. He knows exactly what he's doing . . . He's trapping them in their lies.
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u/Peakevo Apr 16 '25
The interesting thing is that Trump is against both Cuba and Venezuela with dictators and oppressive regimes, yet love El Salvaodor. Kinda contradicts US foreign policy.
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u/NoInstructio3 Apr 16 '25
US foreign policy has never been about defeating dictators esp in LatAm, we actively support and prop them up
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u/93joecarter Apr 16 '25 edited Apr 16 '25
So, if he is dead, Is the US just paying a monthly fee still for the guise of him being detained there?
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u/bmo211 Apr 16 '25
The unconstitutionality IS the point. We don’t have rule of law anymore. The constitutional crisis has already happened. Commenting on Reddit about how the Trump Justice Dept is going to fail in court fatally overlooks the whole and obvious point of this astonishing miscarriage of justice: Trump and his fascist toadies have been flaunting their blatant disregard for the constitution, rule of law, due process. They have been making it clear that we no longer are a constitutional democracy with rule of law as a cornerstone. Americans have been responding with a failure of imagination. Yet it is all in plain sight: this is an authoritarian coup. The coup plotters and executors do not intend to abide by the constitution, comply with judicial orders, or comply with due process. We are overdue to move beyond treating of all this as a political spectator sport. It is a coup; it is authoritarianism. The unconstitutionality is the point. Yet Americans are just sitting around failing to recognize what is plainly their new reality and hoping that the courts keep our democracy on life support. Trump has already pulled the plug.
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u/inbrewer Apr 16 '25
It horrible enough he got sent to a foreign prison by mistake. But exactly how much are citizens of the U.S. paying to keep him there? It’s our money, who approves these types of expenses? Shouldn’t Congress be screaming about this situation?
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u/InternetGamerFriend Apr 16 '25
That place is a death camp. Trump is doing to people of color what the Nazi’s did to the Jews.
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u/DancingWithAWhiteHat America Apr 16 '25
So we can get him back. And our government that lies, lied.
Shocking.
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u/Afasso Apr 16 '25
If you look at CECOT on google maps and zoom in on the building in the top centre.....that sure is a weird looking pile with a big red stain around it.....
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u/joedogyo Apr 16 '25
I feel badly for Garcia but the whole narrative is missing the point. It isn’t that he was sent to El Salvador in defiance of a court order. It’s that he AND 280 others were arrested illegally, not charged with crimes, denied due process, shoved on a plane and, in defiance of yet another court order, flown to El Salvador. This is so much bigger than a dad from Maryland. It is an egregious overreach and criminal behaviour that demands correction. People don’t suddenly become terrorists just because you say they are
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u/Nommel77 Apr 17 '25
Are we also not gonna discus the administration using unapproved tax dollars on this operation? In no way were these funds approved by the legislature. And if I’m wrong please correct me.
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u/cytherian New Jersey Apr 17 '25
Crime committed.
This is NOT a POTUS duty, to deny someone their constitutional rights. SCOTUS ruling on presidential powers does not protect him. Charge Trump with a Crime!
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u/bastiaanvv Apr 16 '25
This makes it even more insane.
If the reason that he is still locked up is that the US is paying El Salvador, just stop paying and have him released?
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u/misoandricegamer Apr 17 '25
When did he start paying for stuff?
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u/FeebysPaperBoat Michigan Apr 17 '25
It’s US taxpayer money. He has no trouble spending that so long as it’s not on school lunches, veterans, education, science, medicine…
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u/SockraTreez Apr 16 '25
I’m psychic.
Here’s what’s going to happen: The Trump admin will label this as fake news and attack any reporter that asks about it.
If the Trump admin goes above and beyond, they will get the Vice President to retract the comment or say it’s false. However, there’s a good chance they’ll do it in a dumb way and get caught. If this happens, they will label it as fake news and attack any reporter that asks about it.
Regardless of what happens the MAGA cult (while likely dressed in red, white and blue) will consider it evidence of how awesome Trump is.
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u/PuffPuffFayeFaye Apr 16 '25
I hope our next president decides to bring some democracy to El Salvador.
And please no more “we won’t have next president” comments. That shit is just normalizing the criminal behavior.
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u/smurfsundermybed California Apr 16 '25
I don't think you understand what you are asking for. Our track record of bringing democracy to Central and South America ain't too good.
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u/Phrogme1 Apr 16 '25
I don’t understand what the big deal is about returning him. Just put Abrego Garcia on a plane. Done. UNLESS Abrego Garcia is not REALLY “alive & secure”. Rumors abound about that prison. Could Abrego Garcia be dead? Injured? Beaten to a pulp??? Harvested for organs??? Inquiring minds wanna know.
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Apr 17 '25
The anti-government types are the first to shout "I voted for this" as Trump and company wipe their asses with the Constitution, the rule of law, and the world order as we knew it. I mean, I almost get it if you live in bumfuck nowhere and will work at the Walmart until you keel over. What are these people losing? Nothing, at least not in their minds. They think "illegals" are coming to America and somehow having a better life than their own meager poverty-level existence. And fuck, maybe they're not that far off, but none of this will change their material conditions for the better at all. It's socialized schadenfreude, they'll feel superior as they rot away in the middle of nowhere doing nothing with their nothing lives.
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u/wildcarde815 Apr 17 '25
by definition they're OUR prisoners, el salvador is a contractor, claiming we can't bring a prisoner WE are incarcerating back is fucking crazy.
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u/HavingNotAttained Apr 17 '25
The French: You raised the retirement age for sanitation workers by three months? BURN IT ALL THE F*CK DOWN!
The Americans: You’re disappearing people, dismantling Social Security, devaluing the full faith and credit of the US Treasury, destroying the FAA, the post office, and the entire medical research establishment? LET’S MAYBE CARRY SOME CLEVER PROTEST SIGNS IN A PARK EVERY OTHER SATURDAY!
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u/EricChen01 Apr 16 '25
I mean it's obvious, and it's just as we suspected. Prob paid to say that he won't release him either. Orange COULD easily get him out if he wanted to (and there are many tactics to do so if just ending payments don't work), but he just REALLY doesn't WANT to do it, defying court order.
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u/Sicalo Apr 17 '25
If it is indeed the case that the Trump Administration is paying them to keep then locked up, then I don't know why everyone is worried.
Everyone knows Trump doesn't pay his bills.
I would say in 3 months he will be late on payments and within 6 months they will send them back due to failure to pay.
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u/kyleharveybooks Apr 17 '25
While I appreciate his attempt… we all know the administration is lying… they know they are lying… just what’s going to be done about it.
The courts can order and put people in contempt… but who will enforce it
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