Anyone else live very close to a large homeless camp?

[u/Unusual-Horse-7709]

I hope this post doesn't get too controversial, but it's getting to a point where I no longer want to work in my garden when I'm home alone. More people have been approaching our home lately. Me, my partner, and even his mom on separate occasions have been asked for things. We've had multiple things stolen, mostly small, but with kids things get left outside.

Do you have a homeless camp within a block or two of your home, and if so, how do you deal with it?

[u/Grisward]

This can’t be a real take, that the vast majority of homeless people want to be that way…

Where were you in January with the long string of days below freezing, when a number of downtown shelters and churches opened up beds to get people out of the dangerously freezing cold? The vast majority of them were just out there for the experience? That is not my observation.

[u/IllTakeACupOfTea → u/Grisward]

I have family that work in social services in a modern, developed country and this arguement does not exist there because their government understands that people need homes. Here, we say things like "they want to be homeless" so that billionaires and millionaires can be a little bit richer.

[u/fe-and-wine → u/IllTakeACupOfTea]

The whole "they want to be homeless" is just a veiled justification for the same "they deserve it" mentality that so many people have towards the underprivileged.

No homeless people want that to be their situation. That's just not a thing that occurs. What does happen is sometimes people get sucked into a tragic cycle of addiction and, when given a small sum of money, make the decision that staving off their withdrawals with another hit is worth more than putting that $20 into a nice shirt to maybe get a job interview to maybe get a job to maybe make enough to maybe solve their homelessness. Eventually.

It's sad, but it's not a crazy calculation to make - especially if you have any first-hand knowledge of how addiction can feel when you're struggling with it.

But rather than seeing this as the tragic 'between a rock and a hard place' situation it is, people like the original commenter above choose to believe it's a reflection of some kind of true meritocracy. "Well they had some money and instead of using it to have a chance at improving their situation, they bought more drugs, so they must want to be homeless. And even if they don't, they deserve it, because they made the wrong choices."

It's something that really frustrates me whenever I think too hard about it - I know plenty of people with this mindset who are otherwise very empathetic and caring individuals. It's not a mindset that is solely motivated by hate (like so many...other prevailing trends in society currently...), I feel like it's almost a subconscious need to make the world 'make sense'. Like it would be too much to accept that we live in a random, cruel, and unfair society where sometimes people just get sucked into the riptide and never break free.

To accept that is to accept that something similar could happen to you - we all make mistakes, so it's scary to believe that one unlucky mistake could land you in the same dismal place. So instead they make themselves believe it's some kind of character flaw or lack of willpower.

Ugh. Didn't mean to type out a novel here but this whole back and forth just put such a fine point on it that it got me thinking. Now I'm sad.

[u/IllTakeACupOfTea → u/fe-and-wine]

The lack of empathy is at the root of so many human problems!

[u/Cutemama14 → u/IllTakeACupOfTea]

What country is this with no homelessness? I’ve traveled a lot and I can’t think of a modern developed country I’ve been to where I haven’t seen homeless people, so I’m curious.

[u/IllTakeACupOfTea → u/Cutemama14]

I never said there was no homelessness, I just said the arguement was not part of the discussion of homelessness. I think that the US is a country that uniquely blames the poor solely for their poverty without taking any look at the way that our society as a whole works only for a limited spectrum of people. We do not function as a modern, developed country in many aspects and this one of them.

[u/mxrider108 → u/Grisward]

Man, you should try going to LA. I lived in Venice for years, and yes many of the homeless there absolutely WANT to live that kind of lifestyle (or, at least, have zero interest in working a job or becoming a productive member of society. I'm sure they'd take a free home if you gave them one).

To be clear: I'm not saying there isn't a societal issue, or that there aren't good people who are homeless, people who are down on their luck and need a hand, etc. But to act like a lot of these people aren't just lazy/love drugs, hate being told what to do, or have severe mental health issues, is also ignoring the reality.

[u/Grisward → u/mxrider108]

I don’t deny some people are disconnected from society to the point that they don’t see a way back, or a motivator to get back.

I commented elsewhere, maybe warm weather changes the dynamic, makes it more visible when there are people cosplaying as a homeless person. A lot of people “choosing” (apparently to some) to be homeless are actually avoiding something else more difficult. Aren’t there people living in cars, or worse, while they have a job?

Mental health I feel like doesn’t deserve to be added to the same category. Mental health problems warrant proper mental health care. Idk how, but it seems we can do something better than homelessness.

Anyway, I’m not denying there are people who may choose for some reason to be homeless, I’m questioning to you and myself what fraction of homeless fit this category. My observation, granted it was in freezing winter weather, was that none of them “chose” that, or very very few.

[u/Optimal-Raspberry-24 → u/Grisward]

It's a real take. As I said in the beginning, " in my experiences". And at the end "the vast majority of the paople I come across". If you have different experience, then great. But don't put my years of direct contact experience down. Nobody likes a troll.

[u/bandalooper → u/Optimal-Raspberry-24]

Making the most of the situation you’re in and wanting to be in that situation are two entirely different things.

[u/mxrider108 → u/bandalooper]

Yes, and there are indeed many who want to be in that situation (maybe not "poor and without a house", but "would rather live outside and steal to get high instead of work a job or be a productive member of society")

[u/FungiMagi → u/bandalooper]

Definitely not saying it’s the majority of people but I have known people who have places to stay but choose to live unhoused in order to travel and not live conventionally. I also have friends who are social workers that work with people on the street and there are folks who don’t want housing assistance. It’s certainly not everyone but for some people I think having the ability to just get up and leave with little effort when a spot is no longer to their liking is preferred to the host of obligations that come with being in a house/apartment.

[u/WynterStorm94 → u/FungiMagi]

People don't want "housing assistance" because the housing offered is almost always comes with laundry list of rules like 100% sobriety, no pets, must be in by 10pm, mandatory room inspections, and stuff like that. They don't just offer people paid for apartments.

[u/Grisward → u/Optimal-Raspberry-24]

I’m not denying you observed this. I’m asking you to question the conclusions a little bit more. Maybe I’m missing something too? Maybe it’s partly to do with where you encounter homeless people.

At a freeway off ramp stoplight, someone asking for money, that’s not the same as someone hopping from shelter to shelter in January 20 degree weather because they don’t stay open all day. Overnight shelter makes them leave by 9am (some by 7am). Lunch shelters open 11:30am, till 1-2pm. Evening shelter rotates each night, usually opens 7pm. None of those people chose to be there. They may have accepted that’s where they had to be in life at that time, but cmon. One night the designated freezing weather shelter was way out of downtown. People waited in line for hours to get a bed, the line was so long too.

I will give a shout out to Raleigh downtown churches who provided shelter during freezing temps. Seeing that, and seeing the people helped by it, truly amazing. Also it shouldn’t be on them only imo.

If someone meanwhile is exploiting homelessness to panhandle, I only suggest the frustration be at people who exploit homelessness. Your point there is valid, I can understand that.

Maybe I have seen a different aspect of homelessness that informed my view. And certainly the summertime setup has got to be markedly different than the below freezing setup. Maybe you see different people in warmer weather than in painful winter.

Either way, I’m of the opinion that people shouldn’t be without shelter and food. I don’t know how to make it work, but Raleigh did amazingly this past winter, and somehow expanding that or using it as a model to follow, seems feasible.