The Great Debate Tourney Final Round

[u/That_guy_why]

Current Brackets

Alright I think you guys got the gist of how things go down now, but Round One's thread has everything in one spot if you don't remember, and feel free to ask for clarifications if you need to. Now, onto the actual decision.

---

The Coin Flip

---

And the coin has decided...

https://gfycat.com/WatchfulPalatableAnchovy

Tails, ergo

The match will be 3 separate 1v1 Singles Matches

Debate Ends when you two finish the agreed terms from the results thread

[u/Verlux]

/u/imadethison6-28-2015 I may as well kick us off I do believe, I hope you enjoyed Memorial Day cuz this is a fight you won't be soon forgetting.

---

TEAM FENG SHILL JI

(link to the lengthy intro since we know each other's shit pretty well by now I believe)

But a tl;dr for our home-viewers:

Tian Wu:

A god whose fists are perpetually imbued with the power of shockwaves; a brick of immense power who can channel his shockwaves into thousands of explosions and eradicate dozens-of-meter tall stone statues just from the AoE of his most powerful shockwaves alone.

Xuan Feng:

A god whose mirth is only exceeded by his skill with the winds themselves, which are his power. Utilizing wind walls, tornadoes that rip up the very earth, and gusts of wind that send people sailing hundreds of miles away, a powerful and playful foe.

Hanfeng Linlin:

A Dark One who channels the Ice of Hell itself via his Soul Gear, blind as a bat but able to sense souls and also discern where his opponents lay from something as minute as ice crystals impacting their body, Hanfeng encompasses all within his aura with Frost and sends foes to a Stygian respite.

---

TIAN WU VS GIN ICHIMARU

---

First up, Fists vs Swords. Tian Wu has no issue deflecting swords that easily slice through iron pre-timeskip, and post-timeskip no-sells a blow from a person superior to NiTian (the owner of those green blades); based on these factors, I think Gin's Shinso is all but useless in this matchup, as its best feat is shoving back Ichigo via Zangetsu, a blade Kenpachi quite casually pushed his way through with ease, showcasing Shinso's inability to pierce steel readily.

However, Gin almost always opens with Shikai, even when pressed, and as such this leaves him at a slight disadvantage from the get-go; with his blade easily deflected by Tian Wu, especially at these speeds, if not outright just caught by Tian Wu, this leaves Gin open to the assault of a person who is not known for holding back readily and outright blitzes if given a chance. Combine this with the fact that Tian Wu can punch hard enough without an overtly Thunder-infused fist to injure the armor of a citizen of Wan Qu (whose base durability easily no-sells an attack well-above this magnitude, and Gin is going to get heavily injured in the first few moments of this battle almost guaranteed.

Gin's agility is usually his trump card as seen against Ichigo; he keeps pace with a dude who reacts to his Bankai, after all. However, that advantage is gone entirely due to speed equalization here, else he'd have a reaction possibility to the assured blitz.

Due to this, Gin will have nearly not opportunity to dodge the hundreds if not thousands of explosions that Tian Wu will unleash immediately afterward, or if he goes the mobility-reduction route Gin will suffer the entirety of those explosions pushed into a small, more condensed area and suffer immense internal trauma.

Gin's in-character hesitancy to unleash Bankai, as is a characteristic with all Captains save Hitsugaya, is damning here. His durability that enabled him to deflect most of a Getsuga Tensho from Ichigo is impressive, but ultimately is well within the bounds of what Tian Wu can match via fists and exceed via Divine Skill. By the time Kamishini no Yari comes out to play, Tian Wu will be in Gin's face, preventing him from getting an easy strike in with the tip of his blade due to being pressed so heavily.

Tian Wu ought to handily take this 7/10 times as a result.

---

XUAN FENG VS VALI LUCIFER

---

So, straight off the bat Divine Dividing is nearly-useless against a man who manipulates the very winds themselves. Nothing in Divine Dividing's feats repertoire suggests it can affect something as nebulous as 'the wind' and meaningfully continue to affect it. Since Divine Dividing requires physical contact, which Vali will never achieve due to speed equalization and Xuan possessing mobility-inhibiting tornadoes as well as a powerful wind-wall, Xuan never need worry about stat or size reduction. Even with Scale Mail, to my knowledge in the primary canon Vali needs the initial physical contact at some point to be able to at-will negate the 10 second rule against opponents and use it from a distance from what we've seen of his pre-Juggernaut self. Further, even if this were not the case, he would be unable to negate the wind-walls and formless sword's potency in any way.

If I'm not mistaken, Vali also breathes yes? I'm pretty sure Xuan Feng's True Void will remain a perpetually potential lethal move to use in case this combat drags on too long against Xuan, as Vali is not the type to engage in Xuan's fun-loving nature or shenanigans. And whilst yes, his nature is a detractor possibly, when serious Xuan has no qualms going from 0-100 pretty damn quickly.

Since Divine Dividing has no real feats that enable it to safely repel Xuan's power, and Scale Mail usage will drive down Vali's stamina rapidly, Xuan ought to be able to win out this battle of endurance.

Xuan should take this handily 6-7/10 due to being able to negate Divine Dividing and his Formless Sword arguably being strong enough to seriously wound Vali, with the rest being a battle of stamina that Xuan should have in the bag.

---

HANFENG LINLIN VS JANE

---

Right out the gate, Jane stands nearly no chance of winning this fight. She is massively, 10/10 outgunned here, only can stand a chance due to speed equalization, and her pain illusion is.....all but useless on Hanfeng for many reasons.

Reason 1. The dude channels the Ice of Hell itself through his body in his every fight and can fight perfectly well regardless of having his blood turned veritably to ice in his veins; it is common knowledge that once an area of flesh gets cold enough, it begins to 'burn', as seen by frostbite actually leaving a burning sensation due to how nerves respond to damage of this sort. Hanfeng legit already has pain tolerance of an unheard of level since he literally freezes his body near-solid each fight and feels the pain of doing so.

Reason 2. Jane's power relies upon eyesight. Hanfeng's Limit Break relies upon an optical illusion that prevents him from being in eyesight. QED, Jane is now a vampsicle cuz her one-trick pony just got put down like the degenerate it is.

Reason 3. Even if we mostly ignore Reason 1 and presume Hanfeng can start to be incapped by the pain, activating his Limit Break is a practically free action that would absolutely be engaged, thus using Reason 2 to defeat any potentially arguable flaws of Reason 1.

Reason 4. Jane has nowhere near the cold resistance feats to survive being within range of Hanfeng for long at all regardless of any of the above, and he passively freezes the area about him, which means she's gonna have difficulty staying in the arena with him at all since he can fight all out, which means difficulty maintaining concentration on him.

Hanfeng is going to 10/10 slaughter her, she really doesn't stand much chance at all here.

[u/IMadeThisOn6-28-2015 → u/Verlux]

I finally made time from my finals and life to be able to respond.

---

My Team:

Gin Ichimaru from Bleach:

Gin was a Shinigami Captain of the Gotei 13 before having defected with Aizen. As all Captains, Gin wields a Zanpakuto and has reached Bankai. His Shikai extends his Zanapkuto 100 sword lengths at super to hypersonic speeds. His Bankai extends 13 km at Mach 500. It has the ability to double it's speed and power with Buto Renjin.

Jane from Twilight:

Jane was just a regular girl that became a vampire while she was being burned on a stake. She was fueled with hatred and wished that those burning her would feel her pain. This manifested into an ability once she fully transformed into a vampire as she now has the ability to cause others to feel an immeasurable pain in their heads that makes the subject feel as if they are on fire and can't be put out. She has higher physicals due to her transformation and her venom has the ability to incapacitate foes as it also feels as if fire is spreading through the subject's body.

Vali Lucifer from HS DxD:

Vali was born with the Longinus Divine Dividing. It comes in the form of silver and blue wings with the ability to divide. Once he has come in physical contact with anything he can divide the stats of that target in half and continue to divide every ten seconds. It also allows him to don a powerful suit of armor to increase physicals and use exotic abilities like Half Dimension where he can halve anything he chooses in the vicinity at once. The ability isn't limited to contact as Vali can divide projectiles without contact and multiple times in less than a second.

---

Fight:

Gin vs Tian Wu:

First up, Fists vs Swords. Tian Wu has no issue deflecting swords that easily slice through iron pre-timeskip, and post-timeskip no-sells a blow from a person superior to NiTian (the owner of those green blades); based on these factors, I think Gin's Shinso is all but useless in this matchup, as its best feat is shoving back Ichigo via Zangetsu, a blade Kenpachi quite casually pushed his way through with ease, showcasing Shinso's inability to pierce steel readily.

I agree with this in the point if Gin struck Shinso directly at Tian. We've seen Shinso cut characters like Hiyori and cross blades with other strong characters like Shinji however that could do more than cut steel. Also your scans show Tian bleeding from the impacts, so I don't think he could endure such strikes for long. He's not impervious. So I would argue Gin could damage Tian rather easily at base even. Shinso is only effective in that it's supposed to increase his range.

this leaves Gin open to the assault of a person who is not known for holding back readily and outright blitzes if given a chance.

You're forgetting our characters are all Mach 300, blitzes and surprises aren't happening. Also, I will argue that Gin doesn't use Shikai when pressed. Gin has never used Shikai when pressed ever, He's only been in a few fights, against Ichigo twice, against Toshiro, against Shinji and against Aizen.

He wasn't supposed to kill Ichigo nor Toshiro, so obviously he wouldn't use Bankai against them in the SS Arc. Against Shinji he didn't need it and he wasn't pressed by him. And when actually seriously fighting Ichigo to test him and trying to kill Aizen, he did use Bankai. So in a fight like this, there isn't a reason he wouldn't use it rather quickly.

Combine this with the fact that Tian Wu can punch hard enough without an overtly Thunder-infused fist to injure the armor of a citizen of Wan Qu (whose base durability easily no-sells an attack well-above this magnitude,

I don't see how these images relate since I see Ah Ghou being told he's too weak and then Ah Ghou break a statue's head. How is that related to Tian Wu's strength when he break a random dude's armor?

Also this doesn't seem like it'd hurt Gin at all. Ichigo easily hits harder than this at Shikai and Gin was not only crossing blades with him, but able to tank a Getsuga from him with only a cut on his head.

Gin's agility is usually his trump card as seen against Ichigo; he keeps pace with a dude who reacts to his Bankai, after all. However, that advantage is gone entirely due to speed equalization here, else he'd have a reaction possibility to the assured blitz.

Well your character also loses their assured blitz since his speed is equal to Gin's reactions, so it's not an option. Neither an option for me.

Due to this, Gin will have nearly not opportunity to dodge the hundreds if not thousands of explosions that Tian Wu will unleash immediately afterward, or if he goes the mobility-reduction route Gin will suffer the entirety of those explosions pushed into a small, more condensed area and suffer immense internal trauma.

These explosions still retain their original speed and explosions aren't that fast compared to Mach 300 characters, there is no reason this should even tag Gin. Also you should give some more context for your last scan, literally tells me nothing. But even if they do tag Gin, these explosions are not much compared to Bankai Ichigo's Getsuga, Gin should be fine even if it tagged him.

Gin's in-character hesitancy to unleash Bankai, as is a characteristic with all Captains save Hitsugaya, is damning here. His durability that enabled him to deflect most of a Getsuga Tensho from Ichigo is impressive, but ultimately is well within the bounds of what Tian Wu can match via fists and exceed via Divine Skill. By the time Kamishini no Yari comes out to play, Tian Wu will be in Gin's face, preventing him from getting an easy strike in with the tip of his blade due to being pressed so heavily.

Well as I said above, it's not Gin's hesitance, but his goals at the time. In his few fights he was only serious twice and those two moments he did use Bankai. For such a fight here where our characters are fighting to the death, there isn't much of a reason Gin doesn't use it much faster. I do agree he'd probably start with Shinso, but he wouldn't wait to use Kamishini. Also for your last line, all Gin has to do is point it at Tian Wu and he's got a sure fire hit. Our characters are locked with reactions at Mach 300. With it being Mach 500 it means Tian wouldn't be able to dodge it and Gin is going to do quite the damage.

So I think Gin very well takes this with minimal difficulty.

---

Vali vs Xuan:

My dude this is a stomp.

So, straight off the bat Divine Dividing is nearly-useless against a man who manipulates the very winds themselves. Nothing in Divine Dividing's feats repertoire suggests it can affect something as nebulous as 'the wind' and meaningfully continue to affect it.

It's divided light, wind doesn't seem like it'd be an issue, just that he knows it's happening since wind is well clear.

Since Divine Dividing requires physical contact, which Vali will never achieve due to speed equalization and Xuan possessing mobility-inhibiting tornadoes as well as a powerful wind-wall, Xuan never need worry about stat or size reduction.

Not at all my dude, Half Dimension does not require contact:

Kiba created another demonic-sword and slashed it towards the tentacle, Samael’s tongue! But it achieved the same results as before! When he went to cut it, the part of the blade that touched it was erased, and the tip of the blade got split in two!

[Half Dimension!]

When Vali made the wings of light appear, Divine-Dividing, his surroundings became warped and all the things got reduced to half while making the sound of the Sacred Gear at the same time. That is Vali’s halving ability!

Here's another:

[Half Dimension!]

Surrounded by a dazzling aura along with a voice from his jewel, Vali pointed his hand at the trees spread out below him. Guban! The thickness of the trees was halved in an instant! Ooh! They were seriously halved!? Gubababababan! More of the surrounding trees were compressed and halved. Don’t ruin the scenery of the old school building!

He won't need contact for this.

Even with Scale Mail, to my knowledge in the primary canon Vali needs the initial physical contact at some point to be able to at-will negate the 10 second rule against opponents and use it from a distance from what we've seen of his pre-Juggernaut self. Further, even if this were not the case, he would be unable to negate the wind-walls and formless sword's potency in any way.

Well nothing shows Vali can't tank or no sell that. I don't recall Fire Dude having the durability feats like Vali. But as I showed above, Half Dimension does work.

If I'm not mistaken, Vali also breathes yes? I'm pretty sure Xuan Feng's True Void will remain a perpetually potential lethal move to use in case this combat drags on too long against Xuan

Well we're not sure if Vali needs to breathe, but that is not an issue when in his armor, it's airtight as he's used it to fly through the Dimensional Gap. The Dimensional Gap being:

The dimensional gap. To make it simple, the human World and the Underworld, the human World and the Heaven, the dimensional wall which exists between them. The boundary which separates the World. Nothing exists there and it is called “The world of nothingness”. I knew she was born there, but...

Being a void of nothing. Issei using his Scale Mail for the Gap:

Either way this dimension won’t last long right? If it is me, I can still move around in the dimensional gap with this armour for a while after the field collapses. It seemed like there was a time when Vali did the same...

A field that is collapsing. Even if I go into the dimensional gap, I will be safe for a while if I wear my armour.

I'ma have to make a part 2 cause Vali and Jane are from books and literary feats take up so much space...